View Full Version : 2006 Massage Parlor Reports
O12,
Good point!
I'm sure many had not thought about those circumstances before passing judgment on this poor guy. LE can and do use means "above the law" to get suspects to do what they want, often threatening community exposure, let alone family involvement.
Somehow I can't believe that most of the men named in the article , given the same circumstances(i.e., pulled over) wouldn't have done the same thing to keep themselves out of trouble.
As we are all not lawyers, and under dourest, cool heads tend not to prevail especially for the guy that has "the family" at home. "Walking a mile in one's shoes" might be appropriate here....God forbid!!
One thing is fore sure these days...hitting the AMPs is dangerous, if you do be prepared to suffer the consequences that might follow.
Now more than ever be safe,
MnV
I am not defending the person who did it, but somehow I bet they were led to believe that the police would be letting their employer or wife know that they were in a "bawdy place".
If you read the Michigan boards there was a case where the police sent letters to the homes of people who parked at a massage parlor. Unfortunately, it the letter was addressed to the registered person, which could have been their wife or gf.
It seems that these two actions violate the 4th amendment, but I am not a lawyer.
O12,
Good point!
I'm sure many had not thought about those circumstances before passing judgment on this poor guy. LE can and do use means "above the law" to get suspects to do what they want, often threatening community exposure, let alone family involvement.
Somehow I can't believe that most of the men named in the article , given the same circumstances(i.e., pulled over) wouldn't have done the same thing to keep themselves out of trouble.
As we are all not lawyers, and under dourest, cool heads tend not to prevail especially for the guy that has "the family" at home. "Walking a mile in ones shoes" might be appropriate here....God forbid!!
One thing is fore sure these days...hitting the AMPs is dangerous, if you do be prepared to suffer the consequences that might follow.
Now more than ever be safe,
MnV
With all due respect man, I went through the same situation this guy did, though mine was actually probably worse, and I think I already talked with you about it. (They could have taken me in on more then getting a massage that day).
Bottom line is, for me it is easy to pass judgement on him. It is really an age old way of dealing with LE. They only have you on what they can prove, or what you tell them.
Zhuxi
With all due respect man, I went through the same situation this guy did, though mine was actually probably worse, and I think I already talked with you about it. (They could have taken me in on more then getting a massage that day).
Bottom line is, for me it is easy to pass judgement on him. It is really an age old way of dealing with LE. They only have you on what they can prove, or what you tell them.
Zhuxi
Z- my brother,
That's my point, most have no idea what their rights are.
I know you've been thru it and understand the ordeal; what I didn't mention to you is, I went thru it too, down in FL where they busted right into the room. Fortunately I was clothed, gave up nothing and was able to walk out.
Though nothing happened to me, it had to be one of the scariest days of my life and I can understand how some might buckle under the strain. As for us, single guys, I can't believe it's not different....
Check your PM,
MnV
Rejected Monke
12-14-06, 13:53
1. The guy who squealed is a pussy for sure.
2. It doesn't seem like any of the "girls" were arrested or charged. That's a relief. However, I have information that their ID's, passports, and visas were all taken away. Hopefully they've been returned since last Friday.
3. How did they catch EIGHT guys (along with the manager)? Maybe I've just never been to HWC during the busy period? Didn't one dude here say he walked in during the bust and just left?
Rejected Monke
12-14-06, 13:54
BTW, yeah it's okay to squeal because you need to save your own "reputation". Meanwhile, you fuck over girls that can barely speak English, let alone defend themselves from the law, who may or may not need the money for legitimate reasons.
Rejected Monke
12-14-06, 14:16
I wonder if the girls will be charged with anything, or if they will just be turned over to ICE like the ones apprehended on Black Wednesday in August.I don't know what the current lineup at HWC was, but I do know that Shasha, Mina, and JoAnne are out and about calling each other on the phone.
Sarang Haeyo
12-14-06, 15:05
Maybe I was rough calling the guy a candy ass BUT: realize that when you walk into an AMP (see Jet's post) you are running a risk just being there. You have to be prepared at all times that you may be confronted by LE either in the place or on your way out.
If you get your rocks off in an AMP you are breaking the law. If you break the law and get nabbed you have to be prepared to suffer the consequences. Common sense dictates: Keep your mouth shut, calm down, let the adrenaline subside, breathe deeply and don't give anything up. Unless of course you're caught with your pants down.
Maybe this is easy for me to say because I've had many run-ins with LE and because I'm finished with the AMP scene. It's time; with all the LE activity surrounding the AMPs; to start thinking with the big head for a while.
Good luck,
SH
Virile Vito
12-14-06, 16:15
Fortunately, I have never been present during a raid, but besides the humiliation and embarassment along with the implied threat to your reputation if you're jailed or go to court, LE can hold you for questioning if there is probable cause. If they thought they had enough evidence to come inside an AMP, they probably already have probable cause to believe that a crime or crimes are taking place inside.
Realistically, however, what goes on BCD is hard to prove. I haven't heard what happened to the guys that were present during the August raids up and down the East Coast.
What seems to be interesting here is that just reading about what allegedly took place there on a "blog" (presumably this board on USA Sex Guide) may not have been enough to get a warrant for LE to go in. If they sent an undercover guy in who tried to negotiate specifc acts for a specific amount and would not touch the girls himself, hopefully the girls would have figured out he was LE and not offered him anything more than a massage and he would have no evidence of any illegal activity.
What it did seem to take to get a warrant to raid the place was this guy's affadavit about his "experience" at the AMP.Gentlemen,
First of all, my sympathies to you. This is a story we are become all-to-familiar with in the Northeast this year.
I think that Jet Ranger's analysis is right on the mark, but unfortunately (w/o an in-depth knowledge of VA's laws and cases) it may be more applicable to avoiding a conviction than avoiding an arrest. For instance, one wonders what in the hell evidence they have on the soliciting a prostitute charge. Did they actually see the money changing hands? Did they hear a request? If they did, could they understand it? Was that guy also dumb enough to admit something (doubtful)?
It is trully difficult to stop run-amok LE from abusing businesses and customers and making arrests on trumped-up charges. It is especially difficult in these situations because of all the idiotic media hype and brainwashing buzzwords that often accompany these busts. Such LE assholes could care less if charges get thrown out, especially if their harassment flays customers in public and drives out our fine AMPs. For a flagrant case of LE abuse you might check the boards for Providence, RI, where it is absolutely legal to get your rocks off at an AMP, but completely baseless, unlawful LE assaults continue anyway. Never underestimate the capacity of LE for utter lying, corruption and willingness to ignore the written and adjudged law.
In truth, the odds of being arrested in an AMP are always going to be slim, but it is something to always bear in mind and be ready for. As Zhuxi and others have alluded to, the first key when getting questioned by LE is to remain calm and quiet. Loose lips sink ships.
Good luck and be safe,
Vito
It's tough to say what anyone would do if you got pulled over leaving an AMP (or similar establishment). I am very familiar with what LE does when they stop people, especially in Florida. They first ask for cooperation. When it is not forthcoming, many will tell you there is an on-going investigation at this location and because you were seen leaving during this investigation you are a potential witness/defendant and thus subject to subpoena at a future date. You are then told that the subpoenas will be delivered to your house when you are out. Guess who they say will be given this paperwork. The wife or SO. Not many spouses will understand why their mates are getting a subpoena to testify in a lewd / lascivious / prostitution investigation. This info is listed on the subpoena. In most cases cooperation is quick and listed as voluntary. It doesn't hurt to say you were in there, but don't admit to everything. Just a little truth in every lie you tell. Just my suggestion.
Good luck and stay safe.
I saw that article and read those names and addresses and it has put the fear into me! I am retired from the scene effective immediately!
It just AIN'T worth it to me anymore!
BE CAREFUL!! and give them a few pumps for me...
JJ
O12,
Good point!
I'm sure many had not thought about those circumstances before passing judgment on this poor guy. LE can and do use means "above the law" to get suspects to do what they want, often threatening community exposure, let alone family involvement.
Somehow I can't believe that most of the men named in the article , given the same circumstances(i.e., pulled over) wouldn't have done the same thing to keep themselves out of trouble.
As we are all not lawyers, and under dourest, cool heads tend not to prevail especially for the guy that has "the family" at home. "Walking a mile in one's shoes" might be appropriate here....God forbid!!
One thing is fore sure these days...hitting the AMPs is dangerous, if you do be prepared to suffer the consequences that might follow.
Now more than ever be safe,
MnV
Tom Thumbs
12-14-06, 21:01
EDITOR'S NOTE: This report was deleted in accordance with the Forum's Zero Tolerance policy regarding reports containing any personal attacks or derogatory comments directed towards another Forum Member or the Forum Membership in general.
Maybe I'm overreacting, but I'm leaning in that direction too and I've been at this for over 9 years.
BigTigg
I saw that article and read those names and addresses and it has put the fear into me! I am retired from the scene effective immediately!
It just AIN'T worth it to me anymore!
BE CAREFUL!! and give them a few pumps for me...
JJ
Jet Ranger
12-14-06, 23:47
Video clip can be found at:
http://dynamic.allbrittontv.com/watchvideo.hrb?s=wjla&i=475
The story even shows part of one of my earlier USG reports on this topic today!
Video clip can be found at:
http://dynamic.allbrittontv.com/watchvideo.hrb?s=wjla&i=475
The story even shows part of one of my earlier USG reports on this topic today!
I couldn't get that one to work...
Try this:
http://dynamic.wjla.com/watchvideo.hrb?s=wjla&id=475
van
Benchseats Rock
12-15-06, 01:17
Not one neighbor saying that they knew what was going on.
Not one neighbor complaining about the traffic hurting their business.
Not one person saying that they've been bitching for years and thank god for this.
Not one person making regular complaints to complex management that there was a "brothel business."
So what is the news here?
The Ministry of Truth is now open for business.
Well, other than the quality of the writing is going to improve now that we know editors and media people are checking in day to day. Oh, that reminds me. Ms. Pennybacker, if you're looking for someone who will write copy for you so that you can spend more time practicing your shocked and appalled look in the mirror so you don't get trapped in a two-shot, I'm your guy. Just send me a pm. I presume you're already a member here.
Benchseats Rock
I'm sure LE was shocked - Shocked! - to learn of alleged improprieties at the Health and Wellness Center (loosely quoting the corrupt police chief in Casablanca). Most likely many a fine officer has received therapy at the establishment over the years. Some time ago, at a certain business in the same county, I was mistaken for LE and was offered services for free. I got the impression that this was a fairly routine cost of doing business. Another time, as I left a different clinic, there were two people in the parking lot jotting down license plate numbers. The next day I saw that the Virginia Dept. of Health had called my house. I suspect there was a connection. Fortunately I am a healthy man, aided in no small part by therapy sessions at these now endangered places.
Good advice indeed. Perhaps even better advice is to make this forum (or create one similar to it) that requires an ID and password to access, and the only way of gaining access to it is by being recommended by someone already known and trusted on the site. Not perfect, but better than what is currently happening.
are greatly aiding LE in collecting information that would most likely be difficult to obtain otherwise. Earlier this year, Sino was popped in MD, and then OS was also popped a few weeks later. In the time between the Sino and OS LE mishaps, the MOCO LE were brazen enough to post in the MOCO forum of this board to thank the local mongers for the specific info they had provided - and further warned that OS was next to go down, which proved to be accurate. It also appears from the news stories related to the recent NOVA activity, that a great deal of specific info once again came from this board.
By providing so much SPECIFIC info in these reports, all providers and clients are at a great risk of LE action. Unfortunately, it is an unneccessary risk that is directly related to the specifity of the info provided in these reports, especially when meaningful reports could still be provided without presenting the unneccessary specifics.
Bottom line - be more thoughtful of what you present in public forums - think before you talk SOOOO much - be protective of yourself and others - for your safety and the safety of everyone else.
Common sense goes a long, long way - especially when your opening your mouth.
are greatly aiding LE in collecting information that would most likely be difficult to obtain otherwise. Earlier this year, Sino was popped in MD, and then OS was also popped a few weeks later. In the time between the Sino and OS LE mishaps, the MOCO LE were brazen enough to post in the MOCO forum of this board to thank the local mongers for the specific info they had provided - and further warned that OS was next to go down, which proved to be accurate. It also appears from the news stories related to the recent NOVA activity, that a great deal of specific info once again came from this board.
By providing so much SPECIFIC info in these reports, all providers and clients are at a great risk of LE action. Unfortunately, it is an unneccessary risk that is directly related to the specifity of the info provided in these reports, especially when meaningful reports could still be provided without presenting the unneccessary specifics.
Bottom line - be more thoughtful of what you present in public forums - think before you talk SOOOO much - be protective of yourself and others - for your safety and the safety of everyone else.
Common sense goes a long, long way - especially when your opening your mouth.
You are right. We should just close the forums all together. As a matter of fact, why don't we just shut off access to the internet; world over.
Like someone once said, LE knows what is going on, without forums. Sure, some discreetness is needed, but really, you think this is the basis for the investigation?
If you paid attention, the bottom line here was that someone (maybe even you) opened their mouth at a traffic stop (with some pressure), not typed possible fiction on a forum.
I doubt the PWC officers took this site URL to the DA.
Zhuxi
You are right. We should just close the forums all together. As a matter of fact, why don't we just shut off access to the internet; world over.
Zhuxi
But how will we continue to make "boom-boom" to the nice K-girls?
I think we need to re-think shutting down the world's internet, there just has to be a better way... :)
MnV
Interesting that not one word in the news coverage about the PWC busts mentioned sex slaves.
Superman06
12-15-06, 20:04
This raid and on going investigation spells the end of an era of a really great establishment. The linked news article and news video are interesting. I find it hard to believe that a tip from a traffic stop started all this. People in the news video seemed shocked that such a business was in the office park. If so, then they couldn't be charged with being a public nuisance. LE knew all about HWC, no doubt some frequented the place. Investigation indeed.
This was probably the most reliable business I have ever dealt with, period. It will be missed.
Benchseats Rock
12-15-06, 23:36
Newbie - I am going to go way the fuck out on a limb here and guess that you havent spent much time RTFFing. If you had, you'd see that we've been through this before, and that even though you bring up some good points the fact of the matter is that these places are going to get busted with or without the forum - I think there is a general consensus that reporting info doesn't make much of a difference either way. That's because when you look at the whole picture, Posse Commitatus is dead and the resulting attitude nationwide, not just is NOVA is that the cops think that they can do whatever they want to whom. The reason that this forum is the one they plaster all over television is that this is the best forum on the planet for mongers to share info and intel - and the truth of the matter is that most of that happens backchannel anyway - and that is the big picture. Jackson is the best at what he does, we're the best at what we do, the media doesn't have a choice but to look at us - they're entirely too busy to go anywhere else.
There are LE on the forum, I am certainly positive that there is LE in the Senior Membership - I am pretty sure that there is LE even among the ranks of the trusted inner circle of Senior Membership - Cops have the best intel, the best drugs, and the best friends to call if you get into trouble in the middle of the night. I have no problem with them here, but I'm not going to be inviting them to any Roundtables either. If you think that this place is their only source of intel then you're young and naive, no biggie. Just grow up a little bit and leave the professional mongering to the professional mongers. We're not going anywhere, and if you stick around for a while, you might just learn something.
One of you owes Zhuxi an apology - or the only intel you'll ever see is the stuff we say in public.
B9 - where the fuck are you?
Benchseats Rock
Mileaminute
12-15-06, 23:53
Newbie - I am going to go way the fuck out on a limb here and guess that you havent spent much time RTFFing. If you had, you'd see that we've been through this before, and that even though you bring up some good points the fact of the matter is that these places are going to get busted with or without the forum - I think there is a general consensus that reporting info doesn't make much of a difference either way. That's because when you look at the whole picture, Posse Commitatus is dead and the resulting attitude nationwide, not just is NOVA is that the cops think that they can do whatever they want to whom. The reason that this forum is the one they plaster all over television is that this is the best forum on the planet for mongers to share info and intel - and the truth of the matter is that most of that happens backchannel anyway - and that is the big picture. Jackson is the best at what he does, we're the best at what we do, the media doesn't have a choice but to look at us - they're entirely too busy to go anywhere else.
There are LE on the forum, I am certainly positive that there is LE in the Senior Membership - I am pretty sure that there is LE even among the ranks of the trusted inner circle of Senior Membership - Cops have the best intel, the best drugs, and the best friends to call if you get into trouble in the middle of the night. I have no problem with them here, but I'm not going to be inviting them to any Roundtables either. If you think that this place is their only source of intel then you're young and naive, no biggie. Just grow up a little bit and leave the professional mongering to the professional mongers. We're not going anywhere, and if you stick around for a while, you might just learn something.
One of you owes Zhuxi an apology - or the only intel you'll ever see is the stuff we say in public.
B9 - where the fuck are you?
Benchseats RockAnd you attempting to determine my life experiece as a hobbiest / monger / owner / pimp / player / gangster and thief are two completely different things. Just because my voice is new to you should never convince you into thinking it is a voice of naieve inexperience - for a judgement of that nature would only bely your self-proclaimed status of wise man.
As far as your intel, your choice, your privilege. Maybe you can offer it up to Zhuxi as the apology you feel he is owed. I'm sure the rest of the universe will survive with or without your intel.
===============================================
Hi guys,
Just to put this in perspective:
1. There is no club, massage parlor, streetwalker location or other place described on this website that the local police don't already know about, with or without this website. Don't be so naive as to think that local LE doesn't already know what's going on in their town.
2. No Forum Members were detained, questioned or investigated as a result of information that they or others posted on this Forum.
3. No information in this Forum was used in any prosecution. It's simply not qualified evidence.
4. The police did not contact me or request any information from me about any forum member, and they never will because the forum's servers are located in Montreal, Canada.
5. When asked about this website, LE is always going to say that they know about the site and that it was a part of their investigation. What else are they going to say? That they don't know about the site? If they say that, then they're going to get chewed up by the media in the very next question.
Thanks,
Jackson
Crackdowns come and go, granted 8/15 is significant to all involved, but all News reports at 10/11pm do is bring more into the hobby. I'm here to testify. Was in the area and clueless for 10+ years, heard a report in 2000-2001 of an AMP getting busted in Montgomery Cty, Md. and thought I might need to check out P4P. Busted my AMP FS cherry at Kona (previously Bethesda), meet many lovely ladies along the way and was fortunite to spend several nice vacations with some of my favorites, all I can say is thanks to the media. Any LE who can find his crusier out front of Dunkins Donuts know exactly where/what AMPs are and what goes on and you've probably had to wait on deck as he finished his session and had suggested his favorite AMP provider probably should take the afternoon off since a DC raid was scheduled.
Yes "you lack intelligible understanding" so take your 3 posts and go away, as your attitude offends me, not to mention your lack of correct spelling!
MnV
At the WHOLE picture instead of just the tiny little part located on the tip of your _ _ _ _, then you would understand that the reason this so called "cooperative monger" in question found himself pulled over and leaned on for some useful info in the first place was because of the so called "fictional" make believe (and yet, incredibly specific) information posted in forums such as this. Even better yet, it was specifically THIS forum from which the information was obtained. Of course, one must automaticlly consider that the numerous news agencies reporting where/how LE got its initial info of supposed illegal activity might just be a "fictional" make believe trick meant to confuse all us mongers.
Clearly, the needless presentation of specific information on THIS board, be it make believe or your weekly wet dream, is what led LE to sit outside of this establishment and pull over the mongers as they exited their sessions. If you are not yet familiar with this LE tactic, then you in definite need of a "street smarts" upgrade. At any rate, that is neither here nor there. The point remains that the cosistently needless posting of such specific information in a publicly accessible forum is dangerous, incredibly stupid, thoughtless. And simply disreagrds the safety of all involved. And its all done for no reason. No benefit and no return.
Stop the forums? No, of course not. However, intel could be presented in a much more diplomatic and discrete manner and still have equal value to the "blow by blow" every detail exposed method generally utilized herein. The bottom line is that many. In fact, most, of the "wet dreamers" aligned herein are like litlle girls with possession of their very first secret. They can't wait to tell their secret to all they meet. All who will listen. In as much detail as possible. And for what? What value, exactly, did this unneccessary disclosure of such specific information add to the "wet dreams" of fantasy contained herein.
Stop the forums. No. But if you can't stop providing such specific info and making it available for any and all who choose to view, then you might as well just join the force yourself. For then, and only then, might you be able to see yourself as the undercover police that you truly are.
By the way, you evidently have one of those fem de fem complexes that you, yourself, are most likely one of the loud mouthed "wet dream" providers of information simply by your "putting words in my mouth" reaction of "You are right, we should just close the forum." No, what we should close is your BIG mouth. A simple re-read of my original post will show absolutely NO mention of closing the forum - so I lack inteligible understanding of your response.
At the WHOLE picture instead of just the tiny little part located on the tip of your _ _ _ _, then you would understand that the reason this so called "cooperative monger" in question found himself pulled over and leaned on for some useful info in the first place was because of the so called "fictional" make believe (and yet, incredibly specific) information posted in forums such as this. Even better yet, it was specifically THIS forum from which the information was obtained. Of course, one must automaticlly consider that the numerous news agencies reporting where/how LE got its initial info of supposed illegal activity might just be a "fictional" make believe trick meant to confuse all us mongers.
Clearly, the needless presentation of specific information on THIS board, be it make believe or your weekly wet dream, is what led LE to sit outside of this establishment and pull over the mongers as they exited their sessions. If you are not yet familiar with this LE tactic, then you in definite need of a "street smarts" upgrade. At any rate, that is neither here nor there. The point remains that the cosistently needless posting of such specific information in a publicly accessible forum is dangerous, incredibly stupid, thoughtless. And simply disreagrds the safety of all involved. And its all done for no reason. No benefit and no return.
Stop the forums? No, of course not. However, intel could be presented in a much more diplomatic and discrete manner and still have equal value to the "blow by blow" every detail exposed method generally utilized herein. The bottom line is that many. In fact, most, of the "wet dreamers" aligned herein are like litlle girls with possession of their very first secret. They can't wait to tell their secret to all they meet. All who will listen. In as much detail as possible. And for what? What value, exactly, did this unneccessary disclosure of such specific information add to the "wet dreams" of fantasy contained herein.
Stop the forums. No. But if you can't stop providing such specific info and making it available for any and all who choose to view, then you might as well just join the force yourself. For then, and only then, might you be able to see yourself as the undercover police that you truly are.
By the way, you evidently have one of those fem de fem complexes that you, yourself, are most likely one of the loud mouthed "wet dream" providers of information simply by your "putting words in my mouth" reaction of "You are right, we should just close the forum." No, what we should close is your BIG mouth. A simple re-read of my original post will show absolutely NO mention of closing the forum - so I lack inteligible understanding of your response.
Bench - B9 is out somewhere fucking June.
I am not going to write a five page response to this.
And, BTW, I do not close my mouth, I only close other peoples mouths, by filling them with my dick.
Zhuxi
We all, me included, are stressed by the recent events but that is no reason to start turning on each other!
LIGHTEN UP!!!
If a few of you really hate each other so much then PLEASE meet up somewhere in the real world and kick the piss out of each other if you want.
Otherwise, please keep that kind of BS out of here!
OK? Remember the reason for this forum in the firt place is to get me that BBBJCIMNQNS I am searching for!
You boys are getting to be just plain tiresome!
JJ
Benefactor9
12-16-06, 10:58
If you had any idea what I've been doing with your wife for the last two years....Your posts here are worthless, and personally I will not waste my time reading the utter blather you have vomited onto your keyboard.
The first thing I saw today was Sleazebum's recommendation for violent solutions, and I concur.
The reason we are here is to brag about our conquests, share notes, and occasionally show of a picture or two. We've done a damned fine job of it, and we haven't gotten anyone arrested. The law enforcement professionals don't need this forum to bust an AMP, as there is plenty of other concrete evidence.
B9 - where the fuck are you?Zhuxi was right. I was out fucking June. Probably will be again in about an hour.
Catch you later,
B9
If you had any idea what I've been doing with your wife for the last two years. Ahh, forget it - she'll tell you herself when she feels the time is right.
Sorry I even brought it up here. For just a second there, it seemed like a great piece of intel to share with our proud community. My bad.To bad I don't have to make shit up to make my point, your "illiteracy" is all the proof I need!
Good luck with your future here on the site.
MnV
Mileaminute
12-16-06, 13:36
I understand exactly how you feel about my post being worthless. After all, most normal people find the truth to be worthless. That's how we all get by in life, right.
Even more, I perfectly understand your decision to not read "the utter blather that I have vomitted". It's okay, I don't mind at all. I realize it's a weekend Saturday and I know how busy you are on Saturdays. After all, it takes time for that double dose of V and a half can of horny goat weed to settle down before you head out to fondilize some hot young asian thang for a ball 60. And then immediately after you gotta run back home a provide a detailed blow by blow forum report of how your erectile dysfunction seems to be subsiding before providing the name, age, address, and immigration status of the poor little thing you just left without even dropping a tip. I don't blame you. I'd wanna have her arrested and immigrated before she could tell everyone that "poor Benefactor...mr. wee wee broken no work no more," too. Hell any of us would respond the same way.
And don't worry, we all understand how you can classify my post as worthless and respond so informatively with your opinion without actually reading what I said. Your evidently a very well educated and highly informed individual.
And by the way, I'm also sorry about your plumbing problem. Maybe you should schedule a rectal exam before it's too late. Quit worrying about "you might like it too much" and just get it done. You'll surely feel better afterwards.
Tom Thumbs
12-16-06, 14:09
Do you know why there is a State court and Federal court?
They try to say Federal Court is like if you attack America.
The real reason for State Court and Federal Court is for you to have a place to to bring the State Court into court which is Federal Court.
But you pretty much have to do the arresting because the FBI ain't going to help.
But you have the right to arrest anybody that breaks the law its called self-defense.
The states break the law all the time its pretty much their goal and they can do it because nobody brings the state into federal court.
Benchseats Rock
12-16-06, 14:40
Reason: Insulting the webmaster.That didn't take too long did it?
Now for the other account.
In case you're not getting the picture asshole, you're not welcome here.
Benefactor9
12-16-06, 15:25
That didn't take too long did it?
Now for the other account.
In case you're not getting the picture asshole, you're not welcome here.
It looks like his other account "Usissybitchu" got nixed as well. I didn't even get a chance to read the PM he sent me.
It's difficult weeding out the ten-year-olds.
Tom Thumbs
12-16-06, 18:51
EDITOR'S NOTE: This report was deleted because the subject was not related to the purpose of this Forum, which is as follows:
The purpose of this Forum is to provide for the exchange if information between men on the subject of finding women for sex.
Benchseats Rock
12-16-06, 21:01
I didn't even get a chance to read the PM he sent me.
I'm sure you must be crushed. I think you, me, and Zhuxi should console ourselves with copious amounts of beer.
CTM Korean Massage Therapy
Just stumble across this.
Trusted members can Back channel for additional information / digits
That didn't take too long did it?
Now for the other account.
In case you're not getting the picture asshole, you're not welcome here.Flame on Bench:
Thank you Bench and Jackson for deleting Assholes promptly! That is what makes this site so great and separates USG from the other CL type of bullshit sites.
Not very opinionated.
Big Red
Rejected Monke
12-17-06, 11:35
We all, me included, are stressed by the recent events but that is no reason to start turning on each other!
LIGHTEN UP!
If a few of you really hate each other so much then PLEASE meet up somewhere in the real world and kick the piss out of each other if you want.
Otherwise, please keep that kind of BS out of here!
OK? Remember the reason for this forum in the firt place is to get me that BBBJCIMNQNS I am searching for!
You boys are getting to be just plain tiresome!
JJI got to agree. Can't we keep these flames to PM?
I'm not sure I clearly understand your statement here Monke. I personally don't have time or space in my PM box for flaming.
Generally speaking I did say generally speaking. If I read something I don't like or agree with I don't need to get the last word in. I generally allow Jackson to do his job. If it's something I feel he's not aware of I send him the message.
Now in regards to putting a lot of information on this board I myself have been guilty. I realize that LE has many other ways of obtaining information without me helping them out. Therefore I am going to try to refrain from too much explicit information.
My post on the DC form #871 "When we share information on the open form here like we do BBBJ, RCG, K9, AR etc. it's like saying here's what she does Face 7.00 Body 7.00 Attitude 9.0 Service 9.0 in this establishment for $.60 to me that's like pissing on someone and saying it's raining. It was brought to the attention of the entire United States via news that forms like this existed. Governments not going to stand by and just ignore it. I just think there's other ways for us to share information like privately PM".
So if I have information I will post it openly. Trusted members can then PM me and we will go from their. If your newbie
1) you've got to pay your dues
2) maybe you came across this site from a trusted member / fiends referral. Have them give you a referral so other know who their talking to.
3) Happy Holidays to all of you.
I'm definitely not trying to run something here but I am concerned that we are shooting ourselves in the foot. I'm definitely open for suggestions.
Happy Hunting
AJ
Rejected Monke
12-17-06, 14:13
I'm not sure I clearly understand your statement here Monke. I personally don't have time or space in my PM box for flaming.I didn't realize you were part of this flamefest. :)
But what I meant was that similar to how you have no time or space in your PM box for flaming - neither does the board. The flames benefit no one, and only serve to either protect one's pride or denigrate someone else's.
Rejected Monke
12-17-06, 14:14
As an addendum, there are times when flames are warranted.
I.E. some guy registers and asks for information. Then when people respond with the standard RTFF flames, that's beneficial for everyone else and the boad.
Rejected Monke
12-17-06, 14:15
And by someone registering and asking for information, I'm talking someone who makes their first post: "please pm me with all information on every amp in the area thx"
Tom Thumbs
12-17-06, 15:16
EDITOR'S NOTE: This report was deleted because the subject was not related to the purpose of this Forum, which is as follows:
The purpose of this Forum is to provide for the exchange if information between men on the subject of finding women for sex.
Tom Thumbs
12-17-06, 15:30
EDITOR'S NOTE: This report was deleted because the subject was not related to the purpose of this Forum, which is as follows:
The purpose of this Forum is to provide for the exchange if information between men on the subject of finding women for sex.
Benchseats Rock
12-17-06, 19:44
I am concerned that we are shooting ourselves in the foot. I'm definitely open for suggestions.
Steel toe boots?
Benefactor9
12-17-06, 21:24
I went to Sakura tonight since my friend June is out of town on vacation.
The wonderful mamasan who used to be at HWC came to the door. She immediately called me by name and gave me a hug. We went to my room and chatted a bit about the old place and things that have happened. She left me to wait for my masseuse.
I drew BB.
She looked familiar, but I determined that I hadn't seen her before. She was a bit standoffish, and then hurried me through an appropriate TS.
Back at the therapy, she did all the right things. I learned to appreciate her face and smile and chatting. Her body was awesome. The closeout made me happy, but I think she experienced a long day today. She made the decision to cuddle after it was all over and made the proper effort at the end to ensure I would accept her if I drew her again.
Face 8 Body 9 Attitude 8 Service 7
Benchseats Rock
12-17-06, 22:56
Flame on Bench:
Thank you Bench and Jackson for deleting Assholes promptly! That is what makes this site so great and separates USG from the other CL type of bullshit sites.
Not very opinionated.
Big Red
Just to clarify a bit here: I am just a member of the forum, same as anyone else. I cannot delete anything other than my own reports, and then, only within 24 hours, same as any other senior member. Any other deletions or forum management come from El Jefe Jackson who is the moderator, the administrator, and cannot be thanked enough for the work that he does and continues to do without complaint - and not for nothing, He has never asked for a penny from any of us, not even once.
Benefactor9
12-17-06, 23:50
Any other deletions or forum management come from El Jefe Jackson who is the moderator, the administrator, and cannot be thanked enough for the work that he does and continues to do without complaint - and not for nothing, He has never asked for a penny from any of us, not even once.
I would also like to point out that Jackson moderates as the SOLE administrator of this forum alone. He has the responsibility of weeding out the posts of at least 1 million users every day.
Wish I knew how he did it without the use of supplementals.
B9
El Jefe Jackson who is the moderator, the administrator, and cannot be thanked enough for the work that he does and continues to do without complaint - and not for nothing, He has never asked for a penny from any of us, not even once.
Heck, who needs money when he has a forum chock full of monger tips :^)
HWC we harldy knew yee. After reading the news story and how this can ruin a life and others.. I'm going to retire from AMP's
HWC we harldy knew yee. After reading the news story and how this can ruin a life and others.. I'm going to retire from AMP'sI agree that the risk is high in VA. If you can get busted for visiting "a known bawdy house" that is a huge risk. I had enjoyed a couple of visits there, but I think I will steer clear of the VA spas for now. I can ill afford to be one of the unlucky ones. I guess you could say you were the plumber: "Just laying pipe, officer."
There are some good girls at the VA spas. I wonder where they will go now, or if they will just take their chances? I suspect it's the latter until their time is up.
Wayward One
12-18-06, 23:49
CTM Korean Massage Therapy
Just stumble across this.
Trusted members can Back channel for additional information / digits
It's been posted on, and no one has given it a good review yet. Do you have any experience that would make it worth trying out?
Comfort Therapeutic Massage (4)
===============
QT - 7/23/06 - Ampamp (?)
??? - 6/15/06 - FWDisaster (-)===
??? - 5/29/06 - Tom Thumbs (?)
??? - 2/15/06 - Sushi Boy (-) no joy
They post ads in the Post.
Comfort Therapeutic Massage
7015 Old Keene Mill rd, suite 102
Springfield, VA
(703)866-7787
M-Sa, 10-7
Ho Ho Ho,
Wayward One
This is not going to be a very Merry Christmas for me. Went on vacation for 2 weeks, got back late Saturday nite closed my eyes and had images of Sasha dancing, moaning through my head. Got up Sunday and jumped in the car and headed south to make my dream come true, failed to RTFF, to find the bell was gone. Man, was I disappointed. So headed off to Plan B and saw the beautiful neons glowing in the window, but didn't feel right after seeing the missing bell at previous establishment. So I did a little drive by to see if things were okay. Did notice a black Ford Explorer parked off to the side by the old box trucks with a guy in it just sitting there, gave me a good stare as I drove by. So I circled around and went through the parking lot again, and got the same glare as I drove by. Didn't feel right, so I stopped by a local eatery to grab some lunch and to plan my next move. Took a deep breath, snatched my balls from the glovebox and headed back, Ford was gone, so up the stairs I went. Bell was present, so I pressed on, and drew Connie. Said she had been there for 2 weeks, cute, probably early 30's, saggy tits, tiny ass, nice personality. Gave okay TS, massage was pretty good, finish was about 7. Left happy, after reading forum, I guess I was lucky too.
I fear it won't be long before Plan B will no longer have the button to push, and the neons fade to black. These are sad days ahead, was saving up for my presents to myself.
I'm sure all of us can find some other entertaining ways to spend our time and money. My wish to all fellow mongers, Happy Holidays, and Happy New Year, Happy AMP Hunting.
Be Safe Mongers
Jet Ranger
12-19-06, 06:11
I would also like to point out that Jackson moderates as the SOLE administrator of this forum alone. He has the responsibility of weeding out the posts of at least 1 million users every day. Wish I knew how he did it without the use of supplementals.Actually, by Jackson's posted stats on the main page, this forum has 139,148 members as of today. I don't know how many of these are senior members, but I imagine it would be a substantial number. I'm sure it is still a daunting task to screen the posts of all the regular members.
Benchseats Rock
12-19-06, 06:35
Actually, by Jackson's posted stats on the main page, this forum has 139,148 members as of today. I don't know how many of these are senior members, but I imagine it would be a substantial number. I'm sure it is still a daunting task to screen the posts of all the regular members.You're not taking into account another 170k users on ISG. Still not a million, but closer than any other forum.
Jet Ranger
12-19-06, 06:59
I agree that the risk is high in VA. If you can get busted for visiting "a known bawdy house" that is a huge risk. I had enjoyed a couple of visits there, but I think I will steer clear of the VA spas for now. I can ill afford to be one of the unlucky ones. I guess you could say you were the plumber: "Just laying pipe, officer."
There are some good girls at the VA spas. I wonder where they will go now, or if they will just take their chances? I suspect it's the latter until their time is up.With the exception of LE barging in and catching a masseuse and a client in the act (coitus interruptus), the most damning evidence (aside from affadavits and statements from patrons about illegal acts), is the presence of condoms on the premises, both used and unused.
When LE was cracking down in Fairfax County a few years ago, my favorite AMP at the time had a "no condoms on the premises" policy and was nominally R&T, but FS was always on the menu IF I brought and disposed of my own condom. Of course, I was a regular, known, and trusted customer there back then. After finishing, the girl would always wad up the used cover in plenty of tissues and made me promise to dispose of it off premises, which I always did, usually at a convenience store trash can down the road.
I'm not familiar with the massage licensing requirements for the NoVA counties (Fairfax, Arlington, Loudoun, and Prince William), but assuming licensing is a requirement, if there is at least one licensed therapist in the establishment and there are no condoms to be found on the premises, barring testimony of a client or clients, it should be difficult to prove the place is a "known bawdy house."
Even the testimony of an undercover LE officer of sexual services offered could be portrayed as an "isolated incident" not authorized or sanctioned by the management (unless LE finds a box with hundreds of condoms on the premises.)
Interestingly, my quick search of the USG archives indicates the first report on HWC offering "special services" was posted in Spring 2002. LE may have visited HWC in the past, but somehow they have managed to survive this long. Either LE didn't have enough evidence to get it shut down or didn't care up until now or a combination of the two.
What will really be interesting during the trial is if the prosecutor plans to introduce USG posts from this board as well as completed VIP cards (if they found any) into evidence to try and convince a jury that HWC was a known "bawdy house." As I have posted before, it all comes down to what constitutes a bawdy house and proving that the guys that were busted there knew they were entering one ahead of time. Nominally, all of us go to an AMP to get just a TS and a massage or just a massage from a young, attractive, skilled Asian woman.
Of course, just being arrested and charged with frequenting a bawdy house will ruin the lives of anyone, but that has always been the risk of visiting these places and that's why I posted the excerpt from the law here a few years ago and recently. I wonder how many cases will get plea bargained and never go to trial. It will take a lot of guts to take a case all the way to trial, though.
When LE was cracking down on AMPs on the West Coast, to survive, many AMPs got rid of table showers completely. They now have conventional walk-in showers where you can self-shower of get an accompanied one.
Even before Black Wednesday, when DC LE was regularly visiting DC AMPs, I remember seeing hilarious signs at Downtown that said "muscle stretching only." One NoVA AMP had posted conspicuously copies of the county code and highlighted the parts where sexual services are banned.
This is not a riskless hobby. Just like any other hazardous hobby, you have to consider the risks and take measures to minimize them if you choose to participate.
Even before Black Wednesday, when DC LE was regularly visiting DC AMPs, I remember seeing hilarious signs at Downtown that said "muscle stretching only." One NoVA AMP had posted conspicuously copies of the county code and highlighted the parts where sexual services are banned.
This is not a riskless hobby. Just like any other hazardous hobby, you have to consider the risks and take measures to minimize them if you choose to participate.Two pretty decent NoVA AMPs still have stuff like that up. One listing everything not allowed; in every room. How nice of them to inform us.
Zhuxi
...After finishing, the girl would always wad up the used cover in plenty of tissues and made me promise to dispose of it off premises, which I always did, usually at a convenience store trash can down the road.
Hmmmmmmm. And all this time I thought that 7-11 was a "bawdy house"!
Man, they're all over the place!
http://www.potomacnews.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=WPN%2FMGArticle%2FWPN_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1149192262297&path=%21news
Two women and five men face charges, including frequenting a bawdy house and receiving money for prostitution.
Police seized cash, condoms, wire transfer slips, rubbing alcohol and an Irish Spring box with pebbles inside of it.
The men charged with running the house would give customers pebbles to prove they paid for services and women working there would accept them as payment, according to court records.
Detectives received a card for the prostitution business and called on Dec. 14, according to an affidavit obtained from Prince William Circuit Court.
The person who answered the phone told the detective "if you know where to go, come on over," according to the affidavit.
The Gang Task Force arrived at 130 Polk Drive, and saw a man driving away. Officers pulled him over to ask him what he was doing at the house, according to court records.
The man who was stopped told detectives that he had just paid $30 to have sex with a "heavy-set" woman, according to the affidavit.
He told the detectives that the girls are normally rotated every week and for his payment he was given a pebble, according to the affidavit.
He would turn the pebble over to one of the girls as payment, according to the affidavit.
Police also seized business cards, a cell phone, cash, identification and more pebbles throughout the house.
The names of the men and women arrested were not available at press time.
Two women and three men were charged with frequenting a bawdy house and two other men were charged with receiving money for prostitution, said Lt. Karen Barton, Manassas Park Police spokeswoman.
Jet Ranger
12-21-06, 06:16
Which one was this?Given the Manassas Park location and involvment of the Gang Task Force, it was probably a Latino establishment. I have to give the Latinos credit, they're usually pretty good at "flying beneath the radar" and keeping their P4P places stealthy.
Note to hobbyists--See the LE tactic used here in this raid, similar to HWC's bust. Keep a place under surveillance, watch a guy leave, and then pull him over and question him on his activities at the place where he just left from.
"The Gang Task Force arrived at 130 Polk Drive, and saw a man driving away. Officers pulled him over to ask him what he was doing at the house, according to court records."
Jet,
Good analysis of the news. A bunch of Latino brothels were raided in Montgomery County last year. I think gangs had been robbing the spas, as well, which helped bring the situation to light.
Given the Manassas Park location and involvment of the Gang Task Force, it was probably a Latino establishment. I have to give the Latinos credit, they're usually pretty good at "flying beneath the radar" and keeping their P4P places stealthy.
Note to hobbyists--See the LE tactic used here in this raid, similar to HWC's bust. Keep a place under surveillance, watch a guy leave, and then pull him over and question him on his activities at the place where he just left from.
"The Gang Task Force arrived at 130 Polk Drive, and saw a man driving away. Officers pulled him over to ask him what he was doing at the house, according to court records."
Pebbles though? That is fucking hilarious.
Zhuxi
Couldn't stop at the time to check it out but saw the sign on in the window yesterday evening.
Tried both today, and no luck. Sakura sign was on, but the open sign was not lighted, and no one came to the door. Kinja sign was out. I tried both before noon. Bummer.
another bust. Couldn't the guy say i was just paying for her time, and what two consenting adults do is their own business. I'm sorry, right now I"m drunk, but does that work. paying for time?
Benefactor9
12-24-06, 08:47
Tried both today, and no luck. Sakura sign was on, but the open sign was not lighted, and no one came to the door. Kinja sign was out. I tried both before noon. Bummer.
June called me yesterday to let me know that Kinja would be closed for a week. All of the masseuses are taking vacation and mamasan has no one to work over the holiday.
another bust. Couldn't the guy say I was just paying for her time, and what two consenting adults do is their own business. I'm sorry, right now I"m drunk, but does that work. paying for time?The Manassas Park raid?
another bust. Couldn't the guy say i was just paying for her time, and what two consenting adults do is their own business.
Why say anything! My lawyer has always told me say nothing.
If you were pulled over for a traffic violation, or a driving impaired violation. Why would I wanna talk to you about the house or building I just left? Talk to me about my driving skills or lack of driving skills!
This guy was a moron!
Happy Hunting
AJ
another bust. Couldn't the guy say i was just paying for her time, and what two consenting adults do is their own business. I'm sorry, right now I"m drunk, but does that work. paying for time?I would say the best option will be, not to say anything. And tell the cop that you want to speak to a lawyer.
Give me my driving citation, or read me my rights and let me make a phone call.
Happy Hunting
AJ
I would say the best option will be, not to say anything. And tell the cop that you want to speak to a lawyer.
Good advice my gentle mongers, but I still want to know, is escorting legal? I mean I pay a girl x amount for her time, and whatever we do is a choice between us. Does that really work? Because I've been thinking about visiting some escorts now, that I have quit amp's for at least now. I just want to have some adult fun and not have to worry about my entire life being destroyed because of some natural urges
Good advice my gentle mongers, but I still want to know, is escorting legal? I mean I pay a girl x amount for her time, and whatever we do is a choice between us. Does that really work? Because I've been thinking about visiting some escorts now, that I have quit amp's for at least now. I just want to have some adult fun and not have to worry about my entire life being destroyed because of some natural urgesI believe as long as it is not money for sex. Hence all the disclosures in escort posting like "Money/donation is provided for time only..blah..blah..blah.." Like you said if you pay for time and then she jumps you well lucky you.
But if they try to get you stay what you want for money like BJ, FS etc I would be cautious cause it sounds like LE. The girls know to use more discretion than that for there safety & yours. Use TER for reviews before you go with a provider. I'm weary of only 1 or 2 reviews. Try to go with someone who is well reviewed for a while.
Called 571-244-9593 for $160 session.
Seniors may PM for details.
Short answer - Do Not Waste Your Money.
JJ
I had a dream that one of our favs re-opened. PM me for details.
AF
Give me my driving citation, or read me my rights and let me make a phone call.
Happy Hunting
AJSay nothing and they will do nothing. Worse case they bring you in and still you say NOTHING. Get a lawyer. Sure you will have some explaining at home but there will be no legal action as long as you do not talk.
Superman06
12-27-06, 21:08
Check out the Chicago Massage Forum. It seems web cameras were discovered at a popular AMP there. Heres a link to the news story.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/187228,CST-NWS-johns27.article
I guess I'm going to have to start wearing a ski mask to sessions so that I won't be reconized.
I had my second visit to AO with Susan. Standard rub and tug. She went topless, but would not take her pants off. Nothing else special about it to report.
I believe as long as it is not money for sex. Hence all the disclosures in escort posting like "Money/donation is provided for time only..blah..blah..blah.." Like you said if you pay for time and then she jumps you well lucky you.
But if they try to get you stay what you want for money like BJ, FS etc I would be cautious cause it sounds like LE. The girls know to use more discretion than that for there safety & yours. Use TER for reviews before you go with a provider. I'm weary of only 1 or 2 reviews. Try to go with someone who is well reviewed for a while.This is the best piece of advise on this page. And yes, definetely check TER for reviews, it can save you a lot of trouble and prevent you from being scammed!
Big Daddy Don
12-28-06, 16:50
If any of you mongers remember Tiffany from HWC, do you know where she went?
I had my second visit to AO with Susan. Standard rub and tug. She went topless, but would not take her pants off. Nothing else special about it to report.Same here. no top off just enough to show some goods. she is very good at massage though. Sheriffs frequent there alot. So they are very scared/careful. Either way try to get Jenny to give acupuncture. She is the real deal and is qualified. She actually belongs in a high rate place.
Check out the Chicago Massage Forum. It seems web cameras were discovered at a popular AMP there. Heres a link to the news story.
http://www.suntimes.com/news/metro/187228,CST-NWS-johns27.article
I guess I'm going to have to start wearing a ski mask to sessions so that I won't be reconized.Is it possible that LE would plant cameras in Massage parlors to keep tabs on them? Would LE even consider doing this? If so, isn't this imvasion of privacy or unconstitutional?
Jet Ranger
12-29-06, 06:26
This is not intended to alarm or discourage anyone from visiting any particular AMP, but in addition to the Commonwealth laws prohibiting bawdy houses and so forth, each county has its own codes regulating massage establishments as well. Below you'll find the Prince William County ordinance in its entirety so you can read and interpret it for yourself.
Note in particular their definition of "sexual parts/erogenous area" in Section 12-3 and see Section 12-17 in particular.
Also note that violations of this code are a Class I misdemeanor.
You'll also note the BS establishments (and therapists) need to go through to get licensed and who can enter a place to search it.
I would assume that if an AMP does not meet these requirements or is unlicensed, it is much easier to make the presumption that it is a "bawdy house."
Finally, even if LE can't prove explicit sexual activity in violation of Section 12-17, the regulators could certainly hassle AMPs that are found not in compliance with these regulations.
If anyone is interested, I also found a copy of the Fairfax County massage code, which I did find prominently on display in an AMP I visited recently. Trusted senior and regular members can PM me for details.
******************************************
ARTICLE I. IN GENERAL
Sec. 12-1. Short title.
This chapter may be referred to as the "Massage Establishment Ordinance" of the county. (Code 1965, § 10A-1)
Sec. 12-2. Declaration of findings and policy.
It is hereby declared that the board of county supervisors has found it necessary and proper to exercise its police power for the protection of the health, safety and general welfare of its citizens by providing for the licensing and regulation of massage therapists, massage establishments, and out-call massage services. (Code 1965, § 10A-2; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-3. Definitions.
For the purposes of this chapter, the following words and phrases shall have the meanings respectively ascribed to them by this section:
Approved program shall mean the course of training at an approved school offered to and required to be successfully completed by any person who is permitted to be a massage therapist in the county. The program must consist of at least the following:
(1) Courses pertaining to anatomy, physiology, hygiene, first aid, exercise therapy, massage techniques and related aspects of the art and science.
(2) Five hundred hours of study, which shall be accredited instructional hours pertaining to:
a. Classroom and clinical training in therapeutic massage and reflexology techniques.
b. Classroom or clinical instruction or contraindications for massage.
c. Classroom or clinical or laboratory instruction to develop a knowledge of the anatomy and physiology of the systems of the body, with emphasis on the muscular and skeletal systems.
Approved school shall mean an approved school is a school or institution of learning which requires, as a condition of graduation or certification, the successful completion of an approved program, and which is licensed to do business as a school or educational institution in the state in which it is located. Any school recognized or approved by, or affiliated with, the American Massage Therapy Association, Inc., shall constitute an approved school.
Director shall mean the director of the Prince William County Health District, or his designee.
Massage shall mean a method of treating, for pay, the external parts of the human body for comfort or the general well-being of the body, by rubbing, stroking, kneading, tapping, or vibrating with the hand or any instrument.
Massage establishment shall mean any establishment having a fixed place of business where massages are administered. The term "massage establishment" shall include but shall not be limited to massage parlors, health clubs, sauna baths and, steam baths, and similar type businesses, whether such business is a public or private facility. This definition shall not be construed to include:
(1) A hospital, nursing home, medical clinic or the office of a physician, surgeon, chiropractor, osteopath or physical therapist duly licensed by the state.
(2) Barbershops or beauty salons in which massages are administered only to the scalp, the face, the neck or the shoulders.
(3) A volunteer fire department, a volunteer rescue squad or a nonprofit organization operating a community center, swimming pool, tennis court or other educational, cultural, recreational or athletic facilities and facilities for the welfare of residents in the area.
Massage therapist shall mean any individual who administers a massage to another individual at a massage establishment or as part of an out-call massage service for pay and who has successfully completed an approved program at, or has been certified by, an approved school of massage. This definition shall not be construed to include a physician, surgeon, chiropractor, osteopath, physical therapist or nurse duly licensed by the state.
Out-call massage service shall mean any business which provides, engages in or carries on massages at a location designated by the customer, client, massage therapist, or other person, which location is other than at a massage establishment as defined herein.
Sexual or genital parts shall include the pubic area, penis, scrotum, vulva, perineum, anus, or female breasts.
(Code 1965, § 10A-5; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89; Ord. No. 93-24, 6-1-93)
Sec. 12-4. Violations of chapter.
Any person violating any provision of this chapter shall be guilty of a Class 1
misdemeanor. (Code 1965, § 10A-3)
Sec. 12-5. Right of entry to enforce chapter.
The director of health, the director of the fire and rescue service, the chief of police, the zoning administrator and the building official, or their duly authorized agents, are hereby authorized to enter, examine and survey, during business hours, any premises in the county for which a massage establishment permit has been issued pursuant to this chapter, for the purpose of enforcing the provisions of this chapter and for no other
official purposes. This section shall not restrict or limit the right of entry vested in any law enforcement agency. (Code 1965, § 10A-16.1)
Sec. 12-6. Revocation or suspension of permits issued under chapter.
(a) Any massage establishment permit or massage therapist's permit granted under this chapter shall be revoked by the director, after notice and hearing, if the permittee (if the permittee is a partnership or association, any partner or member thereof, or if the permittee is a corporation, any officer, director or shareholder owning ten percent or more of its capital stock):
(1) Has been convicted, pleaded nolo contendere or suffered a forfeiture on a charge of violating any provision of Code of Virginia, §§ 18.2-346--18.2-349, 18.2-355--18.2-361, 18.2-368 or 18.2-370, which laws relate to sexual offenses, or any provision of a similar ordinance of the county or law or ordinance of another jurisdiction.
(2) Has been convicted, pleaded nolo contendere or suffered a forfeiture on a charge of violating any provision of this chapter relating to massage establishments, or on a charge of violating a similar law in any other jurisdiction.
(3) Has made a false statement on the application for the permit.
(4) Has failed to make the report required by section 12-10.
Notice of the hearing before the director for revocation of the permit shall be given in writing, setting forth the grounds of the complaint and the time and place of hearing. Such notice shall be mailed, by certified mail, to the permittee's last known address, at least ten days prior to the date set for the hearing.
(b) If the director finds that a massage establishment for which a massage establishment permit has been issued under this chapter does not conform to the standards set forth in this chapter, or that the permittee has refused the director or other authorized person the right to enter the premises to enforce the provisions of this chapter, the director may enter an order for the immediate suspension of the massage establishment permit until such time as he finds that the reason for such suspension no longer exists. The order shall set forth the reasons for the suspension. A copy of the order shall be sent to the permittee at his place of business by certified mail. The permittee shall be afforded an opportunity to be heard by the director within 12 days after the suspension. Notice of the hearing shall be mailed, by certified mail to the permittee's business address, at least ten days prior to the date set for the hearing. No person shall operate a massage establishment when subject to an order of suspension. (Code 1965, § 10a-5; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-7. Compliance with zoning ordinance and building code.
Massage establishments shall be located in a proper zoning district, as specified in Chapter 32 of this Code. Each such establishment and its facilities shall be in conformity with all applicable requirements of the building code adopted by section 5-16 of this Code. (Code 1965, § 10A-14)
Sec. 12-8. Entrance sign.
A recognizable and legible sign shall be posted at the main entrance of each massage establishment identifying the premises as a massage establishment. Any sign comply with the requirements of Chapter 32 of this Code. (Code 1965, § 10A-14)
Sec. 12-9. Display of copy of chapter.
A copy of this chapter shall be displayed in a conspicuous place in every massage establishment, so that it may be readily seen and read by persons entering the premises and employees of the establishment. (Code 1965, § 10A-16)
Sec. 12-10. Information to be reported to director.
(a) Each person to whom a massage establishment permit is issued under article II of this chapter shall report to the director any change in any of the information required by section 12-32, such report to be made within 14 days of learning of the change.
(b) Each holder of a massage therapist's permit issued under Article III of this chapter shall report to the director any change in any of the information required in section 12-52, such report to be made within 14 days of learning of the change. (Code 1965, §§ 10A-8, 10A-11; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-11. Requirements for massage establishments.
(a) Minimum lighting shall be provided in accordance with the Uniform Building Code.
(b) Minimum ventilation shall be provided in accordance with the Uniform Building Code.
(c) Adequate equipment for disinfecting and sterilizing any instruments used for massage shall be provided.
(d) Hot and cold running water shall be provided.
(e) Adequate separate dressing, bathing, and toilet facilities shall be provided for patrons. The facilities for one gender shall be segregated from those for the other.
(f) Walls, ceilings, floors, steam rooms, and all other physical facilities for the
establishment shall be kept in good repair and maintained in a sanitary condition.
(g) Clean towels and linens shall be provided for patrons receiving massage services. No common use of towels or linens shall be permitted. (Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Editor's note: Former §§ 12-11--12-14 were repealed by Ord. No. 89-64, enacted May 2, 1989, which ordinance also enacted a new § 12-11 as hereinabove set forth. The repealed provisions pertained to sanitation, maintenance and massage technicians working only at licensed establishments and derived from §§ 10A-14, 10A-15 and 10A-17 of the 1965 Code.
Secs. 12-12--12-14. Reserved.
Note: See the editor's note following § 12-11.
Sec. 12-15. Cleanliness of therapists.
Every massage therapist shall cleanse his or her hands thoroughly with soap and hot running water immediately before serving each patron. (Code 1965, § 10A-15; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-16. Serving persons with skin inflammation or eruptions.
No massage establishment shall serve any patron when the skin of the patron is inflamed or erupted, unless the patron submits a certificate, from a duly licensed physician, to the director of health stating that such inflammation or eruption is not communicable. (Code 1965, § 10A-15)
Sec. 12-17. Massaging, exposing, etc. erogenous areas.
(a) It shall be unlawful for any person in a massage establishment to place his or her hands upon, to touch with any part of his or her body, to fondle in any manner, or to massage an erogenous area of any other person.
(b) It shall be unlawful for any person in a massage establishment to expose his or her erogenous area, or any portion thereof, to any other person. It shall also be unlawful for any person in a massage establishment to expose the erogenous area, or any portion thereof, of any other person.
(c) It shall be unlawful for any person, while in the presence of any other person in a massage establishment, to fail to conceal, with a fully opaque covering, the erogenous area of his or her body.
(d) It shall be unlawful for any person owning, operating or managing a massage establishment to knowingly cause, allow or permit, in or about such massage establishment, any agent, employee or any other person under his control or supervision to perform any act prohibited by this section. (Code 1965, § 10A-17)
Secs. 12-18--12-30. Reserved.
Editor's note: Former § 12-18, which pertained to massage services to persons of the opposite sex, was repealed by Ord. No. 89-64, enacted May 2, 1989. The repealed provisions derived from § 10A-17 of the 1965 Code.
ARTICLE II. ESTABLISHMENT PERMIT
Sec. 12-31. Required.
It shall be unlawful for any person to own, operate or conduct a massage establishment without a valid, nonsuspended permit issued pursuant to this article for such establishment. (Code 1965, §§ 10A-6, 10A-17)
Sec. 12-32. Application.
(a) Each application for a massage establishment permit required by this article shall be upon a form provided by the director and shall be submitted to the director. Each such application shall contain the following information:
(1) A description of the facilities and services to be available on the premises of the proposed establishment.
(2) The location and mailing address of the establishment.
(3) The name and residential address of the applicant. If the applicant is an association or a partnership, the names and residence addresses of each of the associates or partners. If the applicant is a corporation, the names and residence addresses of each of the officers and directors of such corporation, and of each stockholder owning more than ten percent of the stock of the corporation. If one or more of the stockholders owning more than ten
percent of the applicant corporation is itself a corporation, thenames and residence addresses of each of the officers and directors of such corporation and of each stockholder owning more than ten percent of the stock of the corporation.
(4) If the applicant is an individual, all other addresses of the applicant for the three-year period immediately prior to the application. If the applicant is an association or a partnership, the names and addresses of each associate partner for the three-year period immediately prior to the application. If the applicant is a corporation, all of the addresses for a three-year period of each of the officers and directors of such corporation and of each stockholder owning more than ten percent of the stock of the corporation.
(5) If the applicant is an individual, the birthdate of the applicant. If the applicant is a partnership, the birthdate of each partner. If the applicant is a corporation, the birthdate of each of the officers and directors of such corporation and of each stockholder owning more than ten percent of the stock of the corporation.
(6) If the applicant is an individual, a complete set of the applicant's fingerprints. If the applicant is an association or partnership, a complete set of each associate's or partner's fingerprints. If the applicant is a corporation, a complete set of fingerprints of each of the officers and directors of the corporation and each stockholder owning more than ten percent of the stock of the corporation. The fingerprints shall be taken by the chief of police or his agent.
(7) If the applicant is an individual, the business, occupation or employment of the applicant for the three-year period immediately preceding the date of the application. If the applicant is an association or partnership, the business, occupation or employment of each associate or partner for the three-year period immediately prior to the date of the application. If the applicant is a corporation, the business occupation or employment of each officer or director and each of the stockholders owning more than ten percent of the
stock of the applicant corporation.
(8) The history of the applicant in the operation of massage establishments or a similar business or occupation, including, but not limited to, whether or not such person, in previously operating in this county or another county, city or state under a permit or license, has had such permit or license revoked or suspended and the reason therefor, and the business activity or occupation subsequent to such action of suspension or revocation.
(9) The criminal record, if any, other than misdemeanor traffic violations or traffic infractions, of the applicant. If the applicant is an association or partnership, the criminal record of each associate or partner. If the applicant is a corporation, the criminal record of each officer or director of the corporation and each of the stockholders owning more than ten percent of the stock of the applicant corporation
(10) The name of the operator or manager of the massage establishment. If the operator or manager of the massage establishment is not an applicant, then the operator or manager must provide the information required in this section relative to the applicant.
(b) Each application for a massage establishment permit shall be accompanied by an investigation fee of $65.00, no part of which shall be refundable. Such fee shall be in addition to any permit fee required by this article and any business license tax imposed by the county. (Code 1965, §§ 10A-6, 10A-8; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-33. Inspection of applicant's premises, etc.
Upon receipt of an application for a permit under this article, the director shall refer the application to the building official, the director of the fire and rescue service, the chief of police and the zoning administrator, each of whom, within a period of 21 days from the date of the application, shall review records and make an inspection of the premises proposed to be used as a massage establishment and shall make a written report to the director concerning compliance with the law. (Code 1965, § 10A-6; No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-34. Fee.
The annual fee for a massage establishment permit shall be $10.00, which fee shall be paid prior to the issuance or renewal of the permit. Such fee shall be in addition to any business license tax imposed by the county. (Code 1965, § 10A-7; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-35. Issuance or denial.
A massage establishment permit shall be issued by the director when all provisions of this article have been complied with, if he determines, from the inspections and reports provided for in section 12-33 and from the information contained in the permit application, that the establishment meets the requirements of this chapter and that the applicant is qualified under the requirements of this chapter to engage in such business in the county. Such permit shall be denied, if the director finds any condition to exist that would be grounds for the revocation of a permit under section 12-6. (Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89; Ord. No. 90-140, 11-13-90)
Sec. 12-36. Term.
A permit issued under this article shall be valid for one year from the date of issuance, unless sooner suspended or revoked pursuant to section 12-6. (Code 1965, § 10A-7)
Sec. 12-37. Display.
Every person to whom a massage establishment permit is issued shall display such permit in a conspicuous place in the massage establishment, so that it may be readily seen by persons entering the premises. (Code 1965, § 10A-16)
Sec. 12-38. Transfer.
(a) No permit issued under this article shall be transferable from one person to another.
(b) A change of location of a massage establishment may be approved by the director and the establishment's permit transferred to the new location, provided all applicable provisions of this Code, including this chapter, are complied with. (Code 1965, §§ 10A-12, 10A-13; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Secs. 12-39--12-50. Reserved.
ARTICLE III. MASSAGE THERAPIST'S PERMIT
Sec. 12-51. Required.
(a) It shall be unlawful for any person to administer a massage in a massage
establishment or as part of an out-call massage service, unless he or she has a valid unsuspended massage therapist's permit issued pursuant to this article or has been specifically exempted from the definition of "massage therapist" in section 12-3 of this chapter.
(b) It shall be unlawful for the owner, operator or manager of any massage
establishment to permit any person who does not have the permit required by this section to administer any massage in such establishment. (Code 1965, §§ 10A-9, 10A-17; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-52. Application.
Each application for a massage therapist permit shall be upon a form provided by the director and shall be submitted to the director. Each such application shall contain the following information:
(1) The applicant's full name, residential address, and telephone number.
(2) The name and address of the massage establishment where the applicant is to be employed and the name of the owner of same.
(3) The names and addresses of any and all previous massage establishments where the applicant has been employed as a massage therapist.
(4) The criminal record, if any, other than a misdemeanor traffic violation or traffic infraction, of the applicant.
(5) Whether any permit to perform as a massage therapist has previously been denied or the application revoked and, if so, the circumstances of such denial or revocation.
(6) A complete set of the applicant's fingerprints which shall be taken by the chief of police or his agent.
(7) Written proof that the applicant is 18 years of age or older. (Code 1965, § 10A-11; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-53. Applicant's qualifications, generally.
Each applicant for a massage therapist's permit must be at least 18 years of age and must have satisfactorily completed a course or courses of study in body massage in an approved school of instruction or training. (Code 1965, §§ 10A-9.1, 10A-11.1; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-54. Applicant's health certificate.
Each applicant for a permit under this article must obtain from the director a health certificate within the 12 months preceding the application for a massage therapist's permit. Such certificate shall be issued upon such conditions as the director may deem reasonable and proper to accomplish the purposes of this chapter and to protect the health of patrons and other persons in massage establishments. (Code 1965, § 10A-10; Ord. No.
89-64, 5-2-89)
Cross references: Health certificates generally, Ch. 10
.
Sec. 12-55. Investigation of applicant's criminal record.
Upon receipt of an application for a permit under this article, the director shall request that the chief of police make, or cause to be made, a thorough investigation of the criminal record of the applicant. (Code 1965, § 10A-11.1; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-56. Fee.
The annual fee for a massage therapist's permit shall be $15.00, which fee shall be paid prior to the issuance or renewal of the permit. Such fee shall be in addition to any business or occupation license tax imposed by the county, and any other fees which may be required to engage in the business. (Code 1965, § 10A-10; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-57. Issuance or denial.
(a) A massage therapist's permit shall be issued by the director, if the applicant has paid the fee and meets the qualifications prescribed by this article; provided, however, that the director shall deny any application for a massage therapist's permit, after notice and hearing, if the director finds that any condition exists that would constitute grounds for revocation of such a permit under section 12-6.
(b) The director shall act upon the application for a massage therapist's permit within 60 days from the date of the application. Notice of the hearing before the director for denial of the application shall be given in writing, setting forth the grounds for the denial and the time and place of the hearing. Such notice shall be mailed, by certified mail, to the applicant's last known address, at least ten days prior to the date set for such hearing. (Code 1965, § 10A-11.1; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-58. Not transferable.
No massage therapist's permit shall be transferable from one person to another. (Code 1965, § 10A-12; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-59. Display.
Every person to whom a massage therapist's permit has been granted shall, while in a massage establishment, display such permit in a conspicuous place in the massage establishment. (Code 1965, § 10A-16; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Sec. 12-60. Term.
A massage therapist's permit shall be valid for one year from the date of issuance, unless sooner suspended or revoked. Within one month before the expiration date, the holder of a massage therapist's permit may make application for a new permit as provided in this chapter; provided, however, that applicants whose fingerprints are currently on file with the director shall not be required to provide fingerprints when applying for a new permit. (Code 1965, § 10A-10; Ord. No. 89-64, 5-2-89)
Seva Lurker
12-29-06, 10:06
The Nub,
Yes, the police could plant cameras in the AMPS, but only with a warrant. Otherwise the evidence could be thrown out. Then the cops would have to find some way to enter the premises, install the cameras and other things.
As to the use of cameras in MPs and other similar places, that is really nothing new. When I lived in Tucson many years ago and the local MPs were raided, one of them had a camera hidden behind a two way mirror in the next room. In another case, I read a story in the paper about a couple visiting a notel motel that played sex videos while you did your thing. They were apparently frequent customers and during a break in their activities watched the film on TV. They thought the premise and couple looked familar and they were right. Seems the motel was filming couples in the rooms and then playing the films back to other customers.
This was before the really small cameras we have today. So just keep in mind that someone is probably watching you on a monitor somewhere.
If any of you mongers remember Tiffany from HWC, do you know where she went?
No, but if you find out, please; let me know.
She was wonderful, had her on my birthday, actually.
Zhuxi
Both Sakura and Kinja were closed the other day, so I decided to check out A-Plus Therapy. It is literally just around the corner from the former home of HWC (RIP). There is a small waiting room with a plush couch to sit on. The place wasn't busy, I think I was the only monger visiting - this was around 11 a.m. An older provider, definitely in her forties, gave a good massage. I don't remember her name, it was something Korean I couldn't pronounce. They charge 50 for a half hour, 70 for an hour (I took the hour). The session ended with the standard firm grip found in any run-of-the-mill NOVA AMP, nothing more. There is no real reason for anyone to go out of the way to visit this place, unless you are in the neighborhood and every other joint is closed.
Since getting the HJ at a place is just as illegal as getting full service, why should anyone risk geting busted over just a HJ?
Check out the law of the land and see that even allowing Mr Happy to see the light of day in front of a provider is enough to be destroyed over.
IF I am to get busted, it will be during or after getting everything there is to get - and MUCH more than just the HJ!!
Not worth it, not at all!
Just one old, fat, white man's opinion...
JJ
Both Sakura and Kinja were closed the other day, so I decided to check out A-Plus Therapy. It is literally just around the corner from the former home of HWC (RIP). There is a small waiting room with a plush couch to sit on. The place wasn't busy, I think I was the only monger visiting - this was around 11 a.m. An older provider, definitely in her forties, gave a good massage. I don't remember her name, it was something Korean I couldn't pronounce. They charge 50 for a half hour, 70 for an hour (I took the hour). The session ended with the standard firm grip found in any run-of-the-mill NOVA AMP, nothing more. There is no real reason for anyone to go out of the way to visit this place, unless you are in the neighborhood and every other joint is closed.
My spine needed a non-chiropractic realignment to reduce stress, and I noticed that Sakura and Kinja were both open. I tried Sakura, and was provided a session by Maya. If you are offered the same option, suggest you ask if other therapists are available. She was thorough, but overall it was a disappointing experience. IMHO not worth the investment in either time or money. No explicit complaint was made, for either this site or Mamasan. Mamasan was happy to promise better next time. She is nice.
Hello,
I'm looking for a nice spa in Alexandria or near by. If you'd be so kind to point me in the right direction.
Shoot me a PM.
Thanks
No, but if you find out, please; let me know.
She was wonderful, had her on my birthday, actually.
ZhuxiShe went back to LA.
Truely missed
Jet Ranger
12-29-06, 21:00
See Section 28.1-4-6 and their definition of "erogenous areas" in Section 28.1-1-3. This is fairly similar to the Prince William County ordinance. It seems per Section 28.1-5-2 that almost everyone (e.g. LE, health department, building inspector, etc.) with the exception of the dog catcher has the right to enter and "inspect" massage establishments.
Curiously, I actually saw an extract of this (probably Section 28.1-4-6) framed and displayed in the massage room of a Fairfax County AMP where I have recently gotten FS. Senior and trusted members can PM me for details if interested.
My purpose in posting this and the Commonwealth laws on bawdy houses is just to inform you of what legal risk you might potentially be facing when you enter an AMP for hobbying purposes. Taking common sense precautions, such as wearing a towel around your waist when not otherwise occupied in fun or keeping your opaque undershorts close by is a great way to reduce risk in case of an LE visit. That's why most smart NoVA spa girls wear more conservative attire than their DC counterparts and minimize their time out of their clothes when not otherwise engaged in fun, both for your protection and theirs in case an LE visit takes place.
Hopefully the FS AMPs will find a discreet, low key way to survive without going totally underground like the Latino operated bawdy houses. There are enough overpriced R&T places already in NoVA.
Alternately, perhaps some of the local girls we've enjoyed in Woodbridge might start to work independently out of a condo serving trusted customers and others by referral. I sure miss seeing June, Cherry, and Mina. Even though some of the other Woodbridge AMPs seem to be open after the HWC raid, I can't imagine the fear the girls working there now must have. Even before the HWC raid, some of the girls I talked to there knew they were being watched and they were scared. I am very reluctant to visit any AMP in Woodbridge for the time being as their profile is simply too high with the media coverage we've seen.
Take care and stay safe.
JR
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ARTICLE 1. General Provisions
Section 28.1-1-1. Short title.
This Chapter may be referred to as the "Massage Ordinance" of the County of Fairfax. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-1-2. Declaration of findings and policy.
It is hereby declared that the Board of Supervisors has found it necessary and proper to exercise its regulatory authority under the police power for the protection of the health, safety and general welfare of its citizens by providing for the permitting and regulation of massage therapists and massage establishments. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-1-3. Definitions.
The following words and phrases, when used in this Chapter shall, for the purpose of this Chapter, have the meanings set forth below except in those instances where the context clearly indicates a different meaning:
Client means any person receiving a massage from a massage therapist who has been compensated for administering the massage.
Consumer Protection Commission means the Consumer Protection Commission
established in Chapter 10 of the Fairfax County Code.
Director means the Director of the Department of Telecommunications and Consumer Services unless otherwise stated.
Disqualifying offenses means offenses which disqualify an applicant from obtaining a permit pursuant to this Chapter or, if the offender already holds a permit, which mandate revocation of the permit. Disqualifying offenses are:
(1) Conviction, plea of nolo contendere or a forfeiture on a charge of violating any provision of §§ 18.2-346, 18.2-347 through 18.2-349, 18.2-355 through 18.2-358, 18.2-361, 18.2-368, 18.2-370, 18.2-370.1, 18.2-371, 18.2-386.1 or 18.2-387 of the Code of Virginia, which laws relate to sexual offenses, or any provision of an ordinance of the County or a law or ordinance of another jurisdiction which prohibits the same conduct, within the past ten (10) years.
(2) Conviction, plea of nolo contendere or a forfeiture on a charge of violating any provision of this Chapter, or on a charge of violating a similar law in any other jurisdiction, within the past five (5) years.
(3) Making a false statement on a permit application.
Erogenous areas means the genitals and the nipples and areolae.
Massage means the treatment, for compensation, of soft tissues for therapeutic purposes by the application of massage and bodywork techniques based on the manipulation or application of pressure to the muscular structure or soft tissues of the human body, unless the massage is excluded from regulation by § 28.1-1-4.
Massage establishment means any fixed place of business where a massage is
administered to a client, unless the place is excluded from regulation by § 28.1-1-4.
Massage therapist means any individual certified as a massage therapist by the Board of Nursing of the Commonwealth of Virginia.
Out-call massage means any massage administered for compensation at a location other than at a massage establishment. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-1-4. Exclusions.
The provisions of this Chapter do not apply to the following massages, and such massages are expressly excluded from the requirements of this Chapter:
(a) A massage administered only to the scalp, face, neck, shoulders, arms, hands, and/or the feet.
(b) A massage of the upper body while the client is fully clothed and seated in a chair.
(c) A massage administered in a hospital, or medical clinic or in the office of a
physician, chiropractor, osteopath or physical therapist licensed by the Commonwealth of Virginia.
(d) A massage administered in a nursing home, convalescent care facility, assisted living facility, progressive care facility or life care facility.
(e) A massage administered by a physician, chiropractor, osteopath, physical therapist or nurse, licensed by the Commonwealth of Virginia, in any location.
(f) A massage administered at an organized public event, such as a health fair or sporting event, which is open for participation or viewing by the general public.
(g) A massage administered at a school which offers a massage therapy program that has received programmatic approval from the Virginia Board of Education, Office of Proprietary Schools, or that has been certified or approved by the Virginia Board of Education, Office of Proprietary Schools or the Virginia State Council of Higher Education; provided, however, that this exclusion applies only if the individual administering the massage is a student enrolled at the school and receives no compensation for doing so. (09-00-28.1)
ARTICLE 2. Massage Therapist Permit.
Section 28.1-2-1. Permit required.
(a) It is unlawful for any person to offer or administer a massage in Fairfax County unless he or she has a valid massage therapist permit issued by the Director.
(b) It is unlawful for the owner, operator or manager of any massage establishment to allow any person who does not have the permit required by this section to administer any massage in the establishment.
(c) The Director shall not issue a massage therapist permit to any person who is not certified by the Board of Nursing of the Commonwealth of Virginia as a massage therapist. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-2-2. Permit application, duty to update.
Each application for a massage therapist permit shall be upon a form prepared by the Director. The applicant shall provide full answers to all questions on the application under oath. The completed application shall contain the following information, as well as other information which the Director deems necessary to properly evaluate the application:
(a) The applicant's full name, names by which the applicant previously was known, date and place of birth, and current residential and business addresses and telephone numbers.
(b) A copy of the applicant's massage therapist certification from the Board of Nursing of the Commonwealth of Virginia.
(c) The applicant's personal characteristics, such as height, weight, eye color, hair color, sex and race.
(d) The names and addresses of all massage establishments where the applicant has been employed as a massage therapist within the past three years.
(e) Whether the applicant currently holds or previously held a permit or license to offer or administer massages anywhere in Virginia or in any other state. If the applicant holds or has held any such permit or license, the applicant shall provide the license or permit number and the identity of the issuing authority, and whether such permit or license has ever been revoked or suspended and the reason therefor.
(f) The applicant's criminal record, if any, other than misdemeanor traffic violations or traffic infractions, a complete set of the applicant's fingerprints which shall be taken as directed by the Director, a consent form allowing the Director to obtain a search of the Central Criminal Records Exchange, and an investigation fee in the amount established by the Virginia State Police for conducting the records search.
(g) Three full-face and one profile photograph, in a size designated by the Director.
(h) The application fee of $50. The fee is in addition to any business or occupation license tax imposed by the County, and any other taxes or fees which may be required to engage in the business. During the term of the permit, each person to whom a massage therapist permit is issued under this Section must report to the Director any change in the information required by Subsections (a), (b), (e) or (f) within twenty-one (21) days of learning of the change. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-2-3. Issuance or denial.
(a) The Director shall act upon the application for a massage therapist permit within twenty-one (21) days from the date the Director receives the application.
(b) If the Director determines from the information contained in the permit application and from the Director's investigation that the applicant has committed no disqualifying offenses and that the applicant is otherwise qualified under this Chapter to administer massage therapy in the County, the Director shall issue the permit. Each permit issued by the Director shall be the property of the County and it shall be returned to the Director in the event the permit is suspended or revoked in accordance with § 28.1-2-5 or § 28.1-5-3.
(c) If the Director determines from the information contained in the permit application and from the Director's investigation that the applicant has committed one or more disqualifying offenses or is otherwise unqualified under this Chapter to administer massage therapy in the County, the Director shall deny the application.
(d) If the Director denies an application, the Director shall provide the applicant with written notice setting forth the grounds for the denial. Any appeal shall be filed by the applicant with the Department of Telecommunications and Consumer Services within thirty (30) days after the applicant receives the notice and shall specify the grounds for appeal. The Consumer Protection Commission shall hold an appeal hearing as promptly
as practicable and in no event more than sixty (60) days after the appeal is filed. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-2-4. Term.
A massage therapist permit shall be valid for one (1) year from the date of issuance, unless sooner suspended or revoked. Within thirty (30) days before the expiration date, a permitted massage therapist may apply for a new permit. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-2-5. Validity of permit dependent upon validity of state certification.
The validity of a massage therapist permit issued under this Chapter is dependent upon the validity of the state certification as a massage therapist. Suspension of a massage therapist's certification by the Commonwealth of Virginia shall result in the automatic suspension of the permit issued under this article. Revocation of a massage therapist's certification by the Commonwealth of Virginia shall result in the automatic revocation of the permit issued under this article. Automatic suspensions and revocations are not subject to the appeal procedures established in § 28.1-5-3. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-2-6. Not transferable.
Massage therapist permits are not transferable. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-2-7. Permit display.
Every person to whom a massage therapist permit has been granted shall display the permit while in a massage establishment. (09-00-28.1)
ARTICLE 3. Massage Establishment Permit.
Section 28.1-3-1. Permit required.
It is unlawful for any person to own or operate a massage establishment in Fairfax County unless he has a valid massage establishment permit issued by the Director. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-3-2. Permit application, duty to update.
Each application for a massage establishment permit shall be upon a form prepared by the Director. The applicant shall provide full answers to all questions on the application under oath. The completed application shall contain the following information, as well as other information which the Director deems necessary to properly evaluate the application:
(a) Full application process.
(1) A description of the facilities and services to be available on the premises of the proposed establishment.
(2) The location and mailing address of the establishment
(3) The name under which the establishment will operate.
(4) The applicant's full name, names by which the applicant previously was known, date and place of birth, incorporation or organization, and current residential and business addresses and telephone numbers, as applicable. If the applicant is a privately-held corporation or company, it must supply the information for the corporation or company, each officer and each director. If the applicant is a publicly-held corporation, it must supply the information for the corporation and for the officer or agent who willhave responsibility for the daily operations of the establishment. If the applicant is a partnership, it must supply the information for the partnership and for each partner.
(5) Whether the applicant currently holds or previously held a permit or license to operate a massage establishment or to administer massages anywhere in Virginia or any other state. If the answer is affirmative, the license or permit number, the identity of the issuing authority and whether such permit or license has ever been revoked or suspended and the reason therefor. If the applicant is a privately-held corporation or company, it must supply the information for the corporation or company, each officer andeach
director. If the applicant is a publicly-held corporation, it must supply the information for the corporation and for the officer or agent who will have responsibility for the daily operations of the establishment. If the applicant is a partnership, it must supply the information for the partnership and for each partner.
(6) The criminal record, if any, other than misdemeanor traffic violations or traffic infractions, of the applicant and a consent form allowing the Director to obtain a search of the Central Criminal Records Exchange. If the applicant is a privately-held corporation or company, it must supply the information for each officer and each director. If the applicant is a publicly-held corporation, it must supply the information for the officer or agent who will have responsibility for the daily operations of the establishment. If the
applicant is a partnership, it must supply the information for each partner. Each application shall be accompanied by an investigation fee in an amount equal to the fee established by the Virginia State Police for conducting a records search multiplied by the number of persons making disclosures and providing consent forms.
(7) The name of the operator or manager of the massage establishment. If the operator or manager of the massage establishment is not an applicant, then the operator or manager must provide the information required in this section relative to the applicant.
(8) The application fee of $75.00. This fee is in addition to any business or occupation license tax imposed by the County, and any other taxes or fees which may be required to engage in the business.
(b) Streamlined application process. If any individual required by Subsection (a) to disclose information holds a massage therapist permit issued under this Chapter, that individual may supply, in lieu of the information required by Subsections (a)(4), (a)(5) and (a)(6), his or her name and permit number and either a statement that no changes have occurred since he or she completed the application for the massage therapist permit or a list of any such changes.
(c) During the term of the permit, the applicant must report to the Director any change in the information required in the permit application within twenty-one (21) days of learning of the change. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-3-3. Issuance or denial.
(a) The Director shall act upon the application for a massage establishment permit within sixty (60) days from the date the Director receives the application.
(b) If the Director determines from the information contained in the permit application and from the Director's investigation that the proposed establishment will meet the requirements of this Chapter, that neither the applicant, nor any officers or directors thereof, or its operator or manager, have committed any disqualifying offenses and are otherwise qualified under this Chapter to engage in such business in the County, the Director shall issue the permit. Each permit issued by the Director shall be the property of
the County and shall be returned to the Director in the event it is suspended or revoked in accordance with § 28.1-5-3.
(c) If the Director determines from the information contained in the permit application and from the Director's investigation that the proposed establishment will not meet the requirements of this Chapter, or that the applicant, an officer or director thereof, or an operator or manager have committed one or more disqualifying offenses or are otherwise
unqualified under this Chapter to engage in such business in the County, the Director shall deny the application.
(d) If the Director denies an application, the Director shall provide the applicant with written notice setting forth the grounds for the denial. Any appeal shall be filed by the applicant with the Department of Telecommunications and Consumer Services within thirty (30) days after an applicant receives the notice and shall specify the grounds for appeal. The Consumer Protection Commission shall hold an appeal hearing as promptly
as practicable and in no event more than sixty (60) days after the appeal is filed. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-3-4. Term.
A massage establishment permit shall be valid for one (1) year from the date of issuance, unless sooner suspended or revoked. Within sixty-five (65) days before the expiration date, a permitted massage establishment may apply for a new permit. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-3-5. Permit transfer or change of location.
(a) Massage establishment permits are not transferable from one (1) person to another, whether by sale, lease, merger or otherwise.
(b) If a privately-held corporation or company or a partnership holds a massage establishment permit issued under this Chapter, the transfer of more than ten percent (10%) of the ownership of the corporation, company or partnership to a person or entity who was not an owner when the application was made shall cause the automatic expiration of the permit. The expiration shall occur on the date of the transfer.
(c) A change of location of a massage establishment may be approved by the Director and the establishment's permit transferred to the new location, provided the establishment continues to comply with all applicable provisions of this Code. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-3-6. Permit display.
Every person to whom a massage establishment permit is issued shall display the permit in a conspicuous place in the massage establishment, so that it may be readily seen by persons entering the premises. (09-00-28.1)
ARTICLE 4. Minimum Standards.
Section 28.1-4-1. Compliance with zoning ordinance.
Massage establishments shall be located in a proper zoning district, as specified in the Fairfax County Zoning Ordinance. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-4-2. Requirements for massage establishments.
(a) All massage establishments shall comply with all applicable provisions of the Virginia Uniform Statewide Building Code, including those provisions relating to lighting, ventilation, toilet facilities and accessibility.
(b) Nondisposable tools of the trade shall be disinfected after use upon one client.
(c) Walls, ceilings, floors, bathrooms, and all other physical facilities for the
establishment shall be kept in good repair and maintained in a sanitary condition.
(d) All towels and tissue, all sheets or other coverings shall be used singularly for each client and discarded for laundry or disposal immediately after use. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-4-3. Cleanliness of therapists.
Every massage therapist shall cleanse his or her hands thoroughly with soap and hot running water immediately before administering each massage. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-4-4. Massaging clients with skin inflammation or eruptions prohibited.
No massage therapist may knowingly massage any client infected with any fungus or other skin infections, nor shall service be performed on any client exhibiting skin inflammation or eruptions, unless a licensed physician certifies that a client may be safely served. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-4-5. Massaging clients while therapist ill prohibited.
No massage therapist may massage any client when the massage therapist is suffering from any communicable disease transmitted by skin-to-skin contact or through the secretions of the respiratory tract, including, but not limited to, infectious tuberculosis, measles, meningococcal disease, mumps, chicken pox and Hemophilus Influenzae Type b, or from any skin lesions or disease on the hands or arms, or any nasal or ear discharge or inflamed eyes. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-4-6. Massaging, touching, exposing erogenous areas.
(a) It is unlawful for any person, in a massage establishment or during the course of an out-call massage transaction, to touch, with any part of his or her body or with any object, another person's clothed or unclothed erogenous area.
(b) It is unlawful for any person, in a massage establishment or during the course of an out-call massage transaction, to fail to conceal his or her erogenous areas with a fully opaque covering while in the presence of others.
(c) It is unlawful for any person owning, operating or managing a massage
establishment or out-call massage business to knowingly cause or allow, in or about such massage establishment or as part of an out-call massage business, any agent, employee or any other person under his control or supervision to perform any act prohibited by this section. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-4-7. Restrictions on out-call massage.
Out-call massage may be administered only in the residence of the client. "Residence" means one (1) or more rooms in a residential building or residential portion of a building which are arranged, designed, used or intended for use as a complete, independent living facility which includes permanent provisions for living, sleeping, eating, cooking and sanitation. "Residence" shall not include a motel, hotel, or other accommodation used for transient occupancy. (09-00-28.1)
ARTICLE V. Penalties and Enforcement.
Section 28.1-5-1. Violations of Chapter.
Any person violating any provision of this Chapter shall be guilty of a Class 1
misdemeanor. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-5-2. Right of entry to enforce Chapter.
The Director, the Director of Health, the chief of police, the zoning administrator and the building official, or their duly authorized agents, are hereby authorized to enter, examine and survey, during business hours, any premises in the County for which a massage establishment permit has been issued pursuant to this Chapter for the purpose of inspection and to enforce the provisions of this Chapter. The Director of Health shall inspect each massage establishment at least one (1) time per year to determine whether it
is being operated in compliance with this Chapter. This section shall not restrict or limit the right of entry vested in any law enforcement agency. (09-00-28.1)
Section 28.1-5-3. Revocation or suspension of permits.
(a) Grounds for revocation of any permit granted under this Chapter exist if the permittee, operator or manager has committed any disqualifying offense or repeatedly has had a permit issued under this Chapter suspended. If the permittee is a privately-held corporation or company, grounds for revocation exist in the event of such conduct by the corporation or company or by any officer or director. If the permittee is a publicly-held corporation, grounds for revocation exist in the event of such conduct by the corporation or by any officer or agent who has responsibility for the daily operations of the
establishment. If the permittee is a partnership, grounds for revocation exist in the event of such conduct by the partnership or any partner.
If the Director believes that grounds for revocation of a permit exist, the Director shall give the permittee written notice enumerating the grounds and declaring the Director's intent to hold a hearing at a specified date and time to determine whether revocation is warranted. The notice shall be mailed, by certified mail, to the permittee's last known address, at least ten (10) days prior to the date set for the hearing. At the hearing, the permittee may be represented by counsel, may cross-examine witnesses and may present
evidence in his favor. If the Director finds that any ground for revocation in fact exists, the Director shall revoke the permit. The Director shall issue a written notice of his findings and decision within ten (10) work days of the hearing. Any appeal shall be filed by the permittee with the Department of Telecommunications and Consumer Services within thirty (30) days after a permittee receives the notice and shall specify the grounds for appeal. The Director's action remains in effectduring the pendency of the appeal. The
Consumer Protection Commission shall hold an appeal hearing as promptly as practicable and in no event more than sixty (60) days after the appeal is filed.
(b) Grounds for suspension of any permit granted under this Chapter exist if the permittee has failed to comply with any provisions of this Chapter other than those which mandate revocation. If the permittee is a privately-held corporation or company, grounds for suspension exist in the event of such failure to comply by the corporation or company or by any officer or director. If the permittee is a publicly-held corporation, grounds for suspension exist in the event of such failure to comply by the corporationor by any officer or agent who has responsibility for the daily operations of the establishment. If the permittee is a partnership, grounds for suspension exist in the event of such failure to comply by the partnership or any partner. The Director or any person with a right of entry under § 28.1-5-2 may order the suspension of the permit with or without notice. The order shall set forth the reasons for the suspension. A copy of the suspension order shall be hand delivered or mailed by certified mail to thepermittee's last known address. The Director may end a suspension at any time if the reason for the suspension is corrected. Any appeal shall be filed by the permittee with the Department of Telecommunications and Consumer Services within thirty (30) days after a permittee receives the suspension order and shall specify the grounds for appeal. The Consumer Protection Commission shall hold an appeal hearing as promptly as practicable and in no event more than sixty (60) days after the appeal is filed. (09-00-28.1)
Rejected Monke
12-29-06, 21:58
Alternately, perhaps some of the local girls we've enjoyed in Woodbridge might start to work independently out of a condo serving trusted customers and others by referral. I sure miss seeing June, Cherry, and Mina. Even though some of the other Woodbridge AMPs seem to be open after the HWC raid, I can't imagine the fear the girls working there now must have. Even before the HWC raid, some of the girls I talked to there knew they were being watched and they were scared. I am very reluctant to visit any AMP in Woodbridge for the time being as their profile is simply too high with the media coverage we've seen.Would the people in this forum be willing to pay $200-$300? I kind of doubt it.
I would gladly visit Sue (Sakura) anywhere for up to $200. Perhaps she could team up with one or more of the others and get something set up. Of course, at the normal $160 she would be getting that other $60 rather than giving it to the house. But there would be overhead costs with rent and such.
LADIES - if you decide to do this - count me IN!
JJ
Would the people in this forum be willing to pay $200-$300? I kind of doubt it.
Big Daddy Don
12-30-06, 00:05
She was one of the good ones.
She went back to LA.
Truely missed
Roamin Roman
12-30-06, 03:00
Sleaze, I've generally had good results from the Chinese condo(s), even with the 'Telephone Girl' on a few occasions. (Took me by surprise one time, when she did me CG BB.) Sounds to me like your visit was an atypical one. Either that, or they are under "new management." I've been intermittently out of the area during the past few months, so I've not availed myself of their stock. PM me with details, if you can.
Have fun at the Forum
R::R
Called 571-244-9593 for $160 session.
Seniors may PM for details.
Short answer - Do Not Waste Your Money.
JJ
Of course, at the normal $160 she would be getting that other $60 rather than giving it to the house. But there would be overhead costs with rent and such.
The going rate at the Chinese condos in and around Tyson's Corner is 160 for 45 minutes. But the experience is different than an AMP as there are no facilities for the table shampoo. Typically you may be offered a plain old shower when you arrive and when you leave.
The other service is on a par with the spas, but due to the high turnover in these places (2 weeks or less), the girls do not invest a lot of time in customer development. To them, you are always a one-time visitor. Many spa girls tend to stay longer and develop a client base (as this board will attest) that they will cultivate with "special attention."
Unlike the AMPs the condos require you to call in advance. Some condos are in gated complexes that require the basic 2 call arrangement. This is inconvenient for the casual, "gotta get it now" monger. Plus you probably will not find any reasonably priced condos in downtown DC. You'll have to travel to the 'burbs and for the most part the condos are not on the Metro line.
But if well-know spa girls do go independent i'm sure that they might have a good following...but from my experience the successful condos - in terms of overall customer service - charge 250 and up. This could be steep for the typical spa-goer.
Lex's own experience has been that most apartment AMPs tend to be staffed and run by Chinese while the "conventional" or "store-front" AMPs are almost without exception owned and staffed by Koreans.
Lex's personal and unsubstantiated opinion is that one of the reasons for this apparent ethnic divide is that it has something to do with the differences in Korean and Chinese culture and customs. Koreans tend to be more clannish and group oriented or group dependent than Chinese. Having been in Korea on numerous occasions, I also feel that sex for pay is somehow more tolerated in Korea as it seems to be regarded somehow as a legitimate way for a woman to make a bit of money in that culture. Therefore a Korean woman is more likely to incorporate or tolerate the involvement of others in her entrepreneurial plans and implementation.
So while I have heard of Korean ladies in California who go independent, I don't think it is very common in the rest of the country and I think that when they do, they do it alone. Most of the Chinese apartment AMPs seem to have at least two girls. In most of them, the girls seem to rotate fairly frequently. However I have visited a couple of them in Alaska where the girls tend to stay put for a while.
For the record, I've also found that many of the Chinese girls tend to me more sexually adventurous (or less cautions) than the Koreans. Also less clean.
LexLuther
Visited the friendly AO in Sterling again, Tina again, on rag again...LOL End of the month isnt a good time and I just didnt remember this again. OK massage with hj ending.
She promised more when she was over the rag but need own cover.
PC out
That is all good info for the newbie. I am sure they will appreciate it.
However, since it is highly unlikely that any of of our favorite Koreans will team up in a condo there is nothing more than a fantasy described here.
...still, it would be nice! Sharing a standup shower with any of the favorites would be a very nice experience under any arrangement.
JJ
Lex's own experience has been that most apartment AMPs tend to be staffed and run by Chinese while the "conventional" or "store-front" AMPs are almost without exception owned and staffed by Koreans.
Lex's personal and unsubstantiated opinion is that one of the reasons for this apparent ethnic divide is that it has something to do with the differences in Korean and Chinese culture and customs. Koreans tend to be more clannish and group oriented or group dependent than Chinese. Having been in Korea on numerous occasions, I also feel that sex for pay is somehow more tolerated in Korea as it seems to be regarded somehow as a legitimate way for a woman to make a bit of money in that culture. Therefore a Korean woman is more likely to incorporate or tolerate the involvement of others in her entrepreneurial plans and implementation.
So while I have heard of Korean ladies in California who go independent, I don't think it is very common in the rest of the country and I think that when they do, they do it alone. Most of the Chinese apartment AMPs seem to have at least two girls. In most of them, the girls seem to rotate fairly frequently. However I have visited a couple of them in Alaska where the girls tend to stay put for a while.
For the record, I've also found that many of the Chinese girls tend to me more sexually adventurous (or less cautions) than the Koreans. Also less clean.
LexLuther
The going rate at the Chinese condos in and around Tyson's Corner is 160 for 45 minutes. But the experience is different than an AMP as there are no facilities for the table shampoo. Typically you may be offered a plain old shower when you arrive and when you leave.
The other service is on a par with the spas, but due to the high turnover in these places (2 weeks or less), the girls do not invest a lot of time in customer development. To them, you are always a one-time visitor. Many spa girls tend to stay longer and develop a client base (as this board will attest) that they will cultivate with "special attention."
Unlike the AMPs the condos require you to call in advance. Some condos are in gated complexes that require the basic 2 call arrangement. This is inconvenient for the casual, "gotta get it now" monger. Plus you probably will not find any reasonably priced condos in downtown DC. You'll have to travel to the 'burbs and for the most part the condos are not on the Metro line.
But if well-know spa girls do go independent i'm sure that they might have a good following...but from my experience the successful condos - in terms of overall customer service - charge 250 and up. This could be steep for the typical spa-goer.
JJ,
And your response to my irrelevant post is important in what way?
LexLuther
Jet Ranger
12-30-06, 11:29
So while I have heard of Korean ladies in California who go independent, I don't think it is very common in the rest of the country and I think that when they do, they do it alone. Most of the Chinese apartment AMPs seem to have at least two girls. In most of them, the girls seem to rotate fairly frequently. However I have visited a couple of them in Alaska where the girls tend to stay put for a while.
For the record, I've also found that many of the Chinese girls tend to me more sexually adventurous (or less cautions) than the Koreans. Also less clean.
LexLutherLex,
Your experience matches mine. I have noticed several Korean girls in this area starting to advertise on various web sites as "independent" in-call escorts (check out Ami on eros-dc; her "personal assistant" told me she's Korean) so there may be a new trend developing here. Her in-call rate is $200.
I have lots of experience on the West Coast and as you know most AMPs have done away with the TS due to LE and health department pressure. In fact, my favorite CA AMP was harassed more by the health department than LE. As a result, spa etiquette there is that gentlemen self-shower after they arrive. If there is no TS, you might as well go to a condo. Of course, there is less hassle with an AMP--no appointments needed, no multiple phone calls, an on-scene manager you can complain to for substandard service, etc.
You're right that the Koreans tend to be more collective. My dream of some of our favorite girls collaborating may only be just a dream, but if June or Cherry starting working as in-call independents and provided the full hour and same quality of service to me as they have in the past, I'd pay a premium to see them in a condo.
These LE "crackdowns" go in cycles, it's really too bad that LE can't deal with more serious crimes and leave the AMPs alone. The involvement of the Feds in the Black Wednesday raids and the West Coast raids in early 2006 certainly raises the ante and makes the AMPs a bigger target IMHO.
JR
http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ers/255535611.html
Given the state of NOVA spas, this might be an alternative. LOL
Maybe we can take up a collection and share?
;-)
JJ
http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/ers/255535611.html
Given the state of NOVA spas, this might be an alternative. LOL
Jet Ranger
12-30-06, 22:06
Would the people in this forum be willing to pay $200-$300? I kind of doubt it.If I found a local, regular Asian incall girl (preferably Korean, Japanese, or Chinese) that charged $160 to $200 a session, delivered a consistent GFE for the agreed to time, and worked out of a condo, I would become a regular for sure and I'm sure many other guys would, too.
Perhaps the extra $40 a visit might reduce the frequency of my visits somewhat, but it sure beats getting written up in the local papers as being charged with frequenting a bawdy house!
I wasn't overly impressed with the McLean Chinese Condo, either. I felt that I was shortchanged on time when I visited. The girl was OK, but her hair reeked of nicotine.
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