"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[Cephlapod Love]

If they won't to go after pimps and those forcing people into prostitution, or traffickers, etc etc, have at it, but some young woman who wants to boost her income by having a sugar daddy? It should be nobody's business.

Not to reiterate history, but I think that is EXACTLY why the new law was enacted. BP was THE primary market place for pimped and trafficked girls and in fact facilitated such. IF BP had been proactive and acted on the many suggestions given to BP over the years to curb the trafficking on its website, it would still be around and the law would never have passed. But hey, those guys were greedy and didn't want to do anything that would curtail their $100 MM per year in PROFITS! They were so tone deaf and egregious that the only way to stop them was the new law.

After all the Law is called FOSTA = Fight Online Sex Trafficking Act, and SESTA = Stop Enabling Sex Traffickers Act of 2017. It has nothing to do with legislating morality, your bedroom, etc.

For me, this whole thing is an illustration of how Gubmint works. It doesn't go out of its way to get in the way, but it sure does react when something gets REALLY bad. So IF Gubmint comes to you and suggests you are on the fringe of the law, might make some sense to look around and see if one can get out of their cross-hairs. But hey, repeatedly thumb yer nose at them and one will find out how over reaching they can be.

I'm just sayin'.

[EvilTmp]

Just to add another data point to the SA adventure, almost all girls that aren't "platonic only" (I. E. Sex-averse) are on Tinder in my area. They use some of the same pics so they're easy to identify. Keep that in mind next time you get the "I know my worth" or "I'm not that kind of girl" speech. So no, yes. You don't know and you are that kind.

[DrSummer]

Spot on on almost everything. I agree that almost every girl on SA can be taken to FC given the right amount regardless how attractive or not I am (obviously you have to have some standards of hygiene with you). But I found a small percentage (may be less than 10% of girls on SA) of girls genuinely don't want to sleep on the first date. The key is managing the "degree of her psychological damage" you mentioned. When I find them, I am willing to try several dates with them before going to FC. I do that ONLY with girls who never mention about the allowance until I am willing to give it. I have very strict rules regarding allowance. No allowance for M&G, or any dates not ending up in FC (I pay for dinner etc only, no shopping, other gifts etc). Basically allowance is given after the panties hit the floor and stay there for at least 2 hours. I have found two gems using that approach (a 23 year old recent graduate with no permanent job, a 30 yr old single mom). Both were taken to FC on third date, and found to be fireballs in bed, and one of them I see regularly. The total spend was less than 100 before FC date for each girl. For this to work, you should be seen as trustable by girls, you have to be patient and disciplined not to hand out allowance until panties hit the floor. May be it is rare, but it worked for me.

Stay Safe.

Dr. S.

I think all women on SA and WYP know exactly what a man means by and thinks a "traditional sugar daddy / sugar baby arrangement" is and what a man wants from a "mutually beneficial relationship". Additionally, I also think all women on SA are OPEN to the idea of fucking for money. The cold, hard truth of the matter is that she might not be open to fucking YOU for money.

The women on straight up transactional sites like the former Backpage know they've signed up for the deal where they'll fuck anyone that comes along for money because the monkey on their back is bigger than their desire to not screw an old, ugly, smelly fat guy. They have an immediate need that needs filling, which is their next fix, or if not that, they're so close to the edge financially that they can't afford to be choosy. If you happen to call and turn out to not be disgusting, bonus for her.

The women on SA are in the middle: they're more than willing to fuck for money, but since they aren't desperate (I. E. , don't have a drug problem and aren't about to be homeless or something similar) they're most interested in fucking a successful, wealthy, attractive, powerful man who will ideally fund their day-to-day bills / tuition / designer shoe habit AND mentor them and pave their way to success in life, or some sliding-scale variant of the above. The degree to which she's willing to compromise on this ideal is dependent on a mixture of her own estimation of her attractiveness / SMV, the level of her self esteem, and the degree of her psychological damage. Her horniness level plays only a minute percentage of this algorithm, since an attractive woman can get laid any day of the week she wants.

Men who are and can actually do the above things, to the level a PYT with a princess mindset desires, are few and far between, and even fewer of those are active on SA, making for some slim pickings. This is where the alleged "misinterpretation" of vocabulary comes along. Women on SA know they have to meet up with men to actually see what degree he fits to her ideal above, but the "misinterpretation" and her ability to shame you for even thinking that "she'd sell herself like that" give her the plausible deniability she needs to go out on meet and greets. Additionally, she knows there are some men out there who are rich and / or naive enough to actually pay for a meet and greet or for a few platonic "dates" because "I'm not the kind of girl who sleeps with someone on the first date". (Cough, cough YES, she is. Just not with YOU). If you hear this kind of BS from a woman, best to cut your losses early.

This is why a smart man refuses to pay for meet and greets, and only offers a gift "once the panties hit the floor" and also realizes that a certain amount of game and attractiveness / hygiene is necessary to get these women. In the SA arena, you've got to play your part and channel your inner Richard Gere, even if you're faking it. In addition to "showing her the money" you have to "manage her feelings" while doing it. Sadly, managing her feelings usually increases costs for men.

I personally think she makes the decision on whether she's willing to fuck or not in the first 5 minutes of meeting you, and if she has a "rinsing" mindset, if you're not totally undesirable, she may see how much she can get out of you before you decide that paying for nothing isn't worth it any more.

[GoneForDays]

She's a nurse, but she's also very friendly, if you know what I mean.

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...b-efd922056222

Anyone who has recent dealings with this one and can share, please send me a PM. Thanks.

[ChrisCarr]

Hey all,

http://www.usasexguide.nl/forum/show...=1#post3832966

You can read my experience there. Long story short, if they have proof that you discussed money for sex acts they can and will arrest you. If you go playing with streetwalkers and nab a popo it is not entrapment as you are likely "in an area known for prostitution". Even if you beat the charge you are still going to take the ride.

With that, this bish played me using the facts above. I no longer discuss $ electronically. If they don't sense you are looking for p4 p they will move on to 1 of the hundreds of others who will bite rather than waste time on you. I'm starting to reply to these girls "you are a cop" whenever they open up with a p4p offer. Yes my hit rate is going down, but the drive home after that encounter had me thinking hard about what I want from the hobby, what I'm willing to lose, and how I have to protect myself going forward. Actually reading the RVA SA board is a good start LOL.

If that had been a real cop (and she may have been, lucky day for me) I'd be in a very different and unhappy place.

Sorry for the late response guys. Sometimes this hobby can be more of a part time job. LOL! So according to my buddy, he has been talking to this lady on SA (she has removed her account) and things appears to be going well. There was a red flag but he was clearly excited over the prospect of meeting this hot looking lady that he was already discussing meeting. First mistake was to start discussing money and payment without first meeting her in person. She initiated payment for $350 for allowance as Pay per meet. On the day before they met I advised him to make sure they met at a restaurant just to be sure she's the person in the picture. She refused but eventually agreed to meet him at a restaurant in Reston VA. According to him she continue to bring about money and he continue with the conversation. They agreed to have the encounter at her place. In the process of going to her place, she said she came with uber so he will just give her a ride to her place. When they got to his car, she asked for the money and he handed it over to her, she identify herself as a cop and two other plain clothes officers appeared and told him they have on tape discussing with the female cop and the money is evidence. This is a very dangerous game guys, I don't discuss money with anyone. Ever! I have a way of handling women. My first rule of thump is to ensure that I am safe. I don't meet a woman without first having a casual date. I have some very serious conversation to feel the person. I talk about getting you gift cards and say let's have some adult fun and I will take care of you. I will literally continue to say that I don't pay sex but I don't mind getting you some valuable gift cards for you to look more beautiful but I am not discussing cash payment for sex EVER! I don't show money until after an encounter and we are both ready to leave. I leave the money in a draw and leave the drawer open and just say if you see anything you liked in the draw you can have it.

[DirtyDeeds38]

Sorry for the late response guys. Sometimes this hobby can be more of a part time job. LOL! So according to my buddy, he has been talking to this lady on SA (she has removed her account) and things appears to be going well. There was a red flag but he was clearly excited over the prospect of meeting this hot looking lady that he was already discussing meeting. First mistake was to start discussing money and payment without first meeting her in person. She initiated payment for $350 for allowance as Pay per meet. On the day before they met I advised him to make sure they met at a restaurant just to be sure she's the person in the picture. She refused but eventually agreed to meet him at a restaurant in Reston VA. According to him she continue to bring about money and he continue with the conversation. They agreed to have the encounter at her place. In the process of going to her place, she said she came with uber so he will just give her a ride to her place. When they got to his car, she asked for the money and he handed it over to her, she identify herself as a cop and two other plain clothes officers appeared and told him they have on tape discussing with the female cop and the money is evidence. This is a very dangerous game guys, I don't discuss money with anyone. Ever! I have a way of handling women. My first rule of thump is to ensure that I am safe. I don't meet a woman without first having a casual date. I have some very serious conversation to feel the person. I talk about getting you gift cards and say let's have some adult fun and I will take care of you. I will literally continue to say that I don't pay sex but I don't mind getting you some valuable gift cards for you to look more beautiful but I am not discussing cash payment for sex EVER! I don't show money until after an encounter and we are both ready to leave. I leave the money in a draw and leave the drawer open and just say if you see anything you liked in the draw you can have it.

If this sequence of events really and truly played out like your story, than this is entrapment. It is not solicitation by him. She brought up the money and pushed it and tied it in to a sexual encounter. Unless he literally told her at some point, "I am willing to give you $350 for sex" or some sex act, then she entrapped him. A good lawyer will get this stupid shit tossed out. But who wants to go through all that? This is insane to me, that they don; t have anything better to do then shake down some lonely sugar daddy. Can you imagine the service they could have provided to the community tending to other things with those resources and time spent to pop a lonely ole sugar daddy for a misdemeanor charge?

[CantWinLosin]

More importantly, has anyone seen her LOL. She looks hot.

We had a quick M&G to make sure we're on the same page. Body as advertised, from what I could tell with her clothed (sight, and feel during the hug), slender and a great shape tho' not quite a hardbody, with great tits. Face is really cute, tho' not what I'd call "beautiful", but she certainly won't break any mirrors. Her voice is very soft, high and kinda squeaky / mousy, with a Georgia drawl. She comes across in person as sort of ditzy; dunno if that's real or just an act from the little time I spent with her, but I suspect it's at least a little bit of an act because she doesn't come across that way in text / email. She says she's looking for just one SD for ongoing, but from the discussion here it sounds like she's done more tryouts than anything else.

We have an FC date for next week. More after that.

[Ernest Ll]

Sam's Club sells Hotels.com gift cards (the physical ones) so I throw one in with my business purchases to have on hand. They are very good for my day trips to other cities where the whole name / address check in thing is not a big deal.

When why ou play locally, some genius might ask why you are staying at a hotel.

1) I recently moved, back for a visit and haven't updated DL.

2) House in getting bathroom renovated and I have not water fro 24 h ours.

3) None of your fucking business.

Alternatively, I have gone in person and booked a room and said "Its for an employee flying in for a big presentation, and she is coming straight from a long flight to change and freshen up" and I'm picking her up at the airport so she can just go straight to the room.

Some SBs have been fine telling me their real name so I book the room in their name -- might be trickier with youngen's who might not understand if they take a CC at check in, its for incidentals and nothing will be charged.

Even better, my current SB books the hotel in her name and I either reimburse her as part of her gift or make sure she always has a hotels.com gift card or two.

Brothers,

For those of you in the sugar game seeking a bit more anonymity, I thought I would share the hotel booking technique I've been utilizing as of late.

If you're worrying about a hotel charge appearing on the bank statement or about the drama of paying "cash" at the hotel or a way to alter the name on your actual hotel bill. This method might work for you.

Here are the only things you need:

1. A burner Amazon.com Account.

2. A burner email account.

3. Access to hotels.com.

Amazon offers e-gift cards for Hotels.com that are sent directly to an email address of your choosing upon purchase. Simply choose the amount you want on the card and purchase the Hotels.com e-gift card (please make sure it is the E-GIFT card and not the physical one). Then check your burner email account for the e-gift card and then go to Hotels.com to book the stay.

Note, I typically go to Hotels.com and identify the room I want first and it will tell you to the exact penny how much you need including taxes.

The beauty in this is that on your monthly credit card statement the charge will appear like a normal Amazon transaction and since it is a BURNER Amazon account the purchase history is only for your eyes to see. Note, make sure you don't use the family Amazon account.

Lastly, one of the biggest advantages of booking through Hotels.com using the e-gift card is because you can put in whatever name you want on the reservation booking. This is pure gold. I typically use my "real" last name but I put in a false first name and a false street address.

When you go to check-in at the property this is the information that shows. I have had a couple of "overachieving" hotel staff ask for my license and try to correct the reservation, but I simply say something like "This is a business reservation and my company's payroll department knows me by my middle name so changing it would cause too much confusion trying to get reimbursed" Blah. Blah. I also use this time to make sure the staff has my fake address listed on the reservation. This minor detail ensures that if the receipt is slid under the door in the morning and you're caught slipping and your SB happens to see it, your fake name and fake address will be the only thing that appears.

I haven't run into any issues using this method. But to recap, you must account for the following things.

1. Burner Amazon. Do not forget to log out of family account.

2. When the hotel clerk asks for your driver's license make sure they don't overachieve and try to retype info.

3. Ensure the hotel receipt will appear to your liking during checkout.

Once again, no issues to this approach yet, but I bring it to the group to make sure I'm not missing anything.

Ripper.

[Hot Hot]

Anyone have experiences with this one?

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...0-c73ebcd28d90

[BStreet]

I'll let you know.

My dreams have been good! Tasted sweet, likes to be tasted and likes to taste herself, great ride, , all around good time. Sweet girl.

[NeoDude]

Warning, so I just wrote top and she pretty much outed herself after we had M&G from the other address.

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...d-ec53b93ac1af

Same as.

https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...0-1f12ee6f7467

Care to elaborate? No idea what this means. You met her and she outed herself as what, a tranny?

I cannot see the messages in your SA inbox.

[MrDisDat]

Kwagmire: One of the best post in the last several months.

This should be required reading for any new SD (and some slow-witted experienced ones). As I've said on here, she knows within 5 seconds of meeting you if she's attracted to you. Why the hell would you meet for hours and hours over dinner and long dates? All girls on SA know the deal: the ones that don't belong there and can't stomach older guys write "platonic only". Even them know the deal but aren't willing to pony up their part of the deal so yes, they all know what's expected. Long dates? Fancy dinners? Trips? Are all earned benefits. I've done them all many times. You do that when you know what you have in your hands and she's worth it, not as some free enticement to meet and greet.

And yes if she's on SA she is the kind of girl that sleeps with guys on the first or second meet. It just happens that it might not be with YOU. Any story along the lines "I'm not that kind of girl" is her playing you and thinking you're a sucker.

There are some girls who are genuinely attracted to older guys (trust me, I know) but for each one of those there's 20 girls who see desperate, sad, lonely guys there for the plucking.

Some of you need to stop being such chumps and wake the fuck up.

Well said my friend, well said. I have been in positions where I know if the girl is into me or not. It's true, there are women I have met on SA and we fucked he same night while there are others who I just know is all about the money. I had a date with a young girl for lunch and we appeared to hit it off instantly (at least that's how she appears to behave or my dumb ass mind told me). But we communicate until after couple of hours and she asked me for money for something to purchase. I politely declined that I don't have the budget to render any assistance. Few days goes by and she wants a movie date. In my mind, she's been friendly and has other motives. We both know why we are on SA so should I be wasting my time on these dates? Sometimes you have to see the sheep from a distance, cut your losses and bounce!

[MrDisDat]

Can you (or him, for that matter) be a little more specific? How did the interaction / negotiation go down? Were there any red flags he should have noticed / heeded in hindsight?

Sorry for the late response guys. Sometimes this hobby can be more of a part time job. LOL! So according to my buddy, he has been talking to this lady on SA (she has removed her account) and things appears to be going well. There was a red flag but he was clearly excited over the prospect of meeting this hot looking lady that he was already discussing meeting. First mistake was to start discussing money and payment without first meeting her in person. She initiated payment for $350 for allowance as Pay per meet. On the day before they met I advised him to make sure they met at a restaurant just to be sure she's the person in the picture. She refused but eventually agreed to meet him at a restaurant in Reston VA. According to him she continue to bring about money and he continue with the conversation. They agreed to have the encounter at her place. In the process of going to her place, she said she came with uber so he will just give her a ride to her place. When they got to his car, she asked for the money and he handed it over to her, she identify herself as a cop and two other plain clothes officers appeared and told him they have on tape discussing with the female cop and the money is evidence. This is a very dangerous game guys, I don't discuss money with anyone. Ever! I have a way of handling women. My first rule of thump is to ensure that I am safe. I don't meet a woman without first having a casual date. I have some very serious conversation to feel the person. I talk about getting you gift cards and say let's have some adult fun and I will take care of you. I will literally continue to say that I don't pay sex but I don't mind getting you some valuable gift cards for you to look more beautiful but I am not discussing cash payment for sex EVER! I don't show money until after an encounter and we are both ready to leave. I leave the money in a draw and leave the drawer open and just say if you see anything you liked in the draw you can have it.

[MrDisDat]

The link is broken. What's her screen name?

Sorry about that guys. Here you go: https://www.seekingarrangement.com/m...b-66b38777f00a.

[CantWinLosin]

More importantly, has anyone seen her LOL. She looks hot.

I'll let you know.