"Sugarbabies" / "Arrangements" Amateurs or Not?

[Coolhand2]

Here is how I approach it. First off I am what they need and not the other way around. You must keep that in mind. The most I have ever agreed to is 1k per month with visits of 2 or 3 times a week. Broke up on a 1st and 15th =500 each.

I have signed up for the sight but only for free. I was not sure if it was worth paying. I'm curious as how you make the payments. Do you make a deposit to her bank account or is it a cash payment? Is she willing to accommodate her schedule to yours? I would love to find a situation I could make work once a week with NSA. I have to admit you're making me think about biting the bullet and signing up.

Coolhand2

[Obx Fun]

Here is how I approach it. First off I am what they need and not the other way around. You must keep that in mind. The most I have ever agreed to is 1k per month with visits of 2 or 3 times a week. Broke up on a 1st and 15th =500 each. Its fair to both and trust me all I am going to say is true. I ask for pic's and never give them one. I am married and that would not be discreet If I sent them. I will offer a description. I usually ask for pic's up front so I don't waste my time. If they say no fuck them. Move on. It helps to weed out the non-real ones. I keep it in this area. I only want ones who have a place by themselves that we can use. They must be attractive to me. I'm not just looking for a port. Its not storming in my life. 1k per month is alot for some people but it works for my budget. I never chat sex for $. I ususally talk about rent and such. I always make it know that there has to be chemistry. Both mental and physical. So I will ususally agree to something fair for first visit. If the girl is really in need she will agree to all I have said. If not move on. Trust me. More on there every week. I am seeing a 21 yr olod VCU student from that site now. She is off it now. Beautiful. Giving. A real pleaser. Hot as hell and can suck a ball thru a keyhole. All this is just my opinion and thoughts. Like them? Fine. If not f-you. LOL.
Good hunting + be safe

[Literal2]

Been on SD site and connected with a very agreeable and attractive BBW. A little too big for my liking. The problem there is presenting enough information including pictures to come to the attention of these ladies, who are looking at 100's of EMails. Literal, you must have the magic answer to get them to respond-and therefore open up the treasure chest.

Here is the problem I have with monthly stipends-lack of performance. Once you pay up front the excuses start rolling out.

I have had 2 such arrangements. Both are hot and wonderful performers, but after a short while the agreed on weekly visits became less frequent. Always an excuse-and finally hooking up became like pulling teeth. We have wives who provide that service quite well, SBs / GFs are not supposed to.

Ergo, human nature being what it is, people will do as little as possible for a guaranteed salary. So my advice. And ongoing practice, is to link any stipend to performance-pay for play, which gets us back to the escort mentality.

Yes, I'm not against using a little sugar to get my foot in the door, but after things start rolling along I wouldn't contnue if the relationship didn't become or remain a penetrating one.

I think maybe I was just lucky.

We shall see.

[Snake27]

This is an interesting topic. I also prefer Under The Radar UTR girls and avoid girls who are doing a high volume of business. I think in most cases the high volume girls get burned out and are not into their job, though there are exceptions and it would also depend on the guy. Many high volume girls have emotional problems stemming from either an unhappy childhood or bad life experiences.

My ideal UTR GF is a reasonably stable single woman who has a job outside the sex industry but is struggling to make ends meet and needs extra money. Usually they have a kid or two and the father has deserted them. Actually there are many such women. But where to find them?

I have not tried the online sites because from everything I've read (including a section called Dating Agencies on this forum in the Special Interests section) they are a complete waste of time and money. Too much spam, fakes, and undesirable women. Since I haven't tried the online sites I'd be curious to know if they work, but I think even if they did work the women there are not really UTR by definition.

I have not dated many UTR girls, partly because they are so rare and partly because I'm not that keen on it anyway. But here is what I've found both from experience and a bit of research. Sometimes they'll cruise stripclubs to pick up men. These could be high volume girls. In addition, some of the civilian girls who go to SCs are lesbian. A short conversation will establish what they are doing there. I would not date a stripper, though. Usually if a stripper accepts an arrangement they are either a high volume girl or they don't sleep around much but are very expensive. In a way I would not mind the expense of a stripper but they are in a sex industry job and, as I said above, this tends to burn them out. Another place to find the UTR girls is regular nightclubs. They are so rare that I cannot give any general advice on how to pick them out of the crowd. As I said, my success rate is pretty low. Actually only three girls in 10 years. But that's ok, I'm patient. I have a SO. I'm not desperate.

There is some risk to the UTR girls, both from my experience and from what I've heard and read. For one thing, they may cling to you and then get "dramatic", call your SO, put your business out in public, etc. That didn't happen to me yet. Also you may get attached to them if they are interesting and fun to be with, which can have an emotional toll. Then there's the risk (which is actually a good thing for the girl) that if they have a lot of good qualities they will eventually get scooped up by a high-qualilty single man, and your arrangement is finished. That happened to me earlier this year.

[Pistol Peter]

Been on SD site and connected with a very agreeable and attractive BBW.a little too big for my liking. The problem there is presenting enough information including pictures to come to the attention of these ladies, who are looking at 100's of EMails. Literal, you must have the magic answer to get them to respond-and therefore open up the treasure chest.

Here is the problem I have with monthly stipends-lack of performance. Once you pay up front the excuses start rolling out.

I have had 2 such arrangements. Both are hot and wonderful performers, but after a short while the agreed on weekly visits became less frequent.always an excuse-and finally hooking up became like pulling teeth. We have wives who provide that service quite well, SBs / GFs are not supposed to.

Ergo, human nature being what it is, people will do as little as possible for a guaranteed salary. So my advice.and ongoing practice, is to link any stipend to performance-pay for play, which gets us back to the escort mentality.

[Literal2]

Personally I would never have tried the sites beyond the worthless free trials if it hadn't been for your posts OBX. I'm having a blast and I'm grateful to you. Yes, you are generous with leads too. I don't think you caused an uproar. I caused the uproar because I ignored the correct classification of the threads and some folks really, really care about classification. Plus this is an anonymous monger forum and mongers get grouchy without enough pussy. That equals uproar. So don't worry about it. Thanks again.

[Obx Fun]

When I originally spoke of these other sites I didn't know it would cause such an uproar. It's only my opinion when I speak of them. Funny tho. I brought 3 different girls to everyones attention from those sites because I share when I can. And it seems alot of guys enjoyed my find. They came from those sites. You that are curious can go back and check for the 3 I shared. How many have most of you brought in or shared? Maybe it doesn't work for some but they work for me. Thats all I will say to this.

Good Luck all.

Be safe

[Literal2]

I mentioned I have been zeroing in on a third girl from "that site." The other two were easy, pussy pix of one, which you have seen and the squirter. Number 3 is turning out to be harder. Very hot in the texting,"oh! My pussy is so wet for you," that kind of thing, but now I am trying to get close enough to actually fuck her she is dancing around,"oh! Maybe I can't do it, not now, we'll do it later," etc. Etc. Frustrating? Yes. But fun. I love the chase almost as much as catching a girl. (I realize many guys don't, no disrespect intended to anyone else's preferences). So I don't think I will get to fuck number 3 this weekend after all but I may make some progress. I do plan to return to Tabby and see if I can get her to squirt again. Not in jail, no.

[Mrjlg10]

I am on the SD site! There are a few local escorts on there trying to mask there real intent. There are also some real woman on there who want to be spoiled (their words)! I'm in contact with a few woman on there now. They are very eager to meet and get something going. I haven't decided which one I really want to see. When I do I'll let you know the outcome. Either way no matter what label they use it's all the same.

"Angel" is closer to 40 than 26, has been known by many names, and was busted in a very highly publicized and very visible bust a few years ago as being the madam of an escort service along with her pimp be / f. She did hard time. Avoid her like the plague.

There are a lot of girls on these sites that have seen the news-magazine pieces on this sort of thing happening in NYC and LA, and have pretty unrealistic expectations for what they can make, hence the ads for average-looking-but-fancy-sounding girls that have learned marketing but think they're worth a whole lot more than they are. OTOH, there are rich SOBs out there that will pay that sort of money. For a primo porn-star-quality girl. None of those types from around here on the SB sites, although there are a few very-nice ladies and a couple of seriously-hot MILFs.

That said, there are some girls. And some MILFs. That are hurting in this economy, and are turning to this as a way to make ends meet. Some are trying the SB thing first because it offends their sensibilities less than turning multiple tricks per day. Until they learn that the SB scenario is not (usually) a steady income, at which point they either give up or become your traditional escort.

As for legalities, if it's an exchange of sex for anything of value, it's prostitution. Proving that it's that and not just your typical date that includes sex is the tough part, especially if the exchange is not in cash or is unassociated with the meeting. This is one reason the ladies like the arrangement of a single monthly stipend that's exchanged outside the normal contact of the relationship. But you also have to remember that, in most jurisdictions, prostitution is a misdemeanor, which means two things: first, the cops must either witness the illegal act or you or your friend admit to the crime, and that's very unlikely in these scenarios; and second, the cops' first interest is always the visible-to-the-public activity. Get the walkers off the street and the obvious hookers out of the motels. There are relatively few SBs, they're almost never public in what they do, and the effort (cost to the taxpayer) it takes to pursue and actually bust a SB for prostitution is way too high for what will be a misdemeanor conviction. The law is pretty specific as to what constitutes prostitution exactly so that taking a date out to dinner and then going back to your place for sex is not considered prostitution. SBs live on that difference.

[CantWinLosin]

A couple of commercial sites specialize in hookups with girls who aren't supposed to be pros but definitely want something more than a kiss on the cheek at the end of the evening. The sites themselves offer "free trials" but once you sign up you get a couple emails per day, supposedly from girls who want to meet you. You can't actually contact them unless you become a paying member though. So are these sites worth it? Are they really a place where you can meet so-called amateurs who don't advertise elsewhere? The question is complicated by the fact that there appears to be a range of girls on the sites, from strippers to students. I have posted in other threads about my experiences with the one site I belong to. In the case of the other site, which emphasizes "arrangements," I'm not a paying member but I have a "free trial." It lists 2, 700 girls in Virginia. In Richmond, here's what one girl says about herself:

Hi my name is Angel and I am an exotic dancer. I've danced in Las Vegas and on the East Coast. Originally from Va. Beach, Virginia, my first love is the ocean, and living a healthy, happy lifestyle is so important to me. I love shopping, getting my hair done, massages, manicures, pedicures, and tanning. I am available for generous gentlemen who want to go out once or twice a week to dinner, movies, or events. I like strip clubs, visual fun for both of us. And I would like to get a new car this year.

My Appearance: 36c-24-34, long blonde hair, green eyes. 5'5, tan, athletic. 125 lbs. Look forward to meeting someone sweet and nice. Lots of love, Angel. Xxooxxx

Angel says she is 26 and doesn't indicate what kind of arrangement she is seeking, other than she wants a car. Do you think she might accept donations to a "car fund"? Probably negotiable is my take on it.

Another girl has a nude pic with her nipples whited out (?) , wants to go out and have fun, and says she is a 19 (or 20) year old receptionist seeking $3k. $5k per month (!)

"Just need help paying for tuition and some living expenses"

Then there is a 19-year old, somewhat awkward looking in her (fully clothed) pix, who says:

"Hey! I'm an artist living in richmond. I love going to the movies, hanging out with my girlfriends, meeting new people, comedy, going out, staying in, just about everything. I'm super laid back and I always have a good time. I get along with just about everybody and love to laugh and be merry. Let me know if you are interested in meeting me!

I gave this a shot earlier this year but ended up dating someone. Needless to say; I'm single again and ready to give it another go.

Nothing special about my situation. Just a young woman frustrated with "dating" men my age. I enjoy the company, conversation, and other benefits of an older gentleman."

For what it is worth, my initial estimate is that here we have 1. A moonlighting stripper; 2. An escort or a want to be escort; and 3. A girl who is clueless but willing to hang out with older men who she knows will expect sex from her.

Now to each his own, but for me, if I were going to pursue one of these girls, it would be number 3, the 19-year old "artist." It's the awkwardness and self-consciousness she displays in her post that I like, and her photo shows a reasonably pretty girl. She'd be a little nervous and we would beat around the Bush for a while, but I think she is the one with the most potential for a mind-blowing fuck. But that's just me.

So back to the question, are these sites worth it? The answer appears to me to be: not if you are looking for or prefer pros. Pros are going to advertise elsewhere. Strippers you can go fondle. Well, not in Richmond. And take for a test drive before you ask her for takeout. But an awkward, fully clothed. 19 year old artist coming off a relationship who wants to meet older men who are looking for a mistress? I don't know any other reliable way of finding such girls. Maybe if you hang out at the laundromat long enough.

"Angel" is closer to 40 than 26, has been known by many names, and was busted in a very highly publicized and very visible bust a few years ago as being the madam of an escort service along with her pimp be / f. She did hard time. Avoid her like the plague.

There are a lot of girls on these sites that have seen the news-magazine pieces on this sort of thing happening in NYC and LA, and have pretty unrealistic expectations for what they can make, hence the ads for average-looking-but-fancy-sounding girls that have learned marketing but think they're worth a whole lot more than they are. OTOH, there are rich SOBs out there that will pay that sort of money. For a primo porn-star-quality girl. None of those types from around here on the SB sites, although there are a few very-nice ladies and a couple of seriously-hot MILFs.

That said, there are some girls. And some MILFs. That are hurting in this economy, and are turning to this as a way to make ends meet. Some are trying the SB thing first because it offends their sensibilities less than turning multiple tricks per day. Until they learn that the SB scenario is not (usually) a steady income, at which point they either give up or become your traditional escort.

As for legalities, if it's an exchange of sex for anything of value, it's prostitution. Proving that it's that and not just your typical date that includes sex is the tough part, especially if the exchange is not in cash or is unassociated with the meeting. This is one reason the ladies like the arrangement of a single monthly stipend that's exchanged outside the normal contact of the relationship. But you also have to remember that, in most jurisdictions, prostitution is a misdemeanor, which means two things: first, the cops must either witness the illegal act or you or your friend admit to the crime, and that's very unlikely in these scenarios; and second, the cops' first interest is always the visible-to-the-public activity. Get the walkers off the street and the obvious hookers out of the motels. There are relatively few SBs, they're almost never public in what they do, and the effort (cost to the taxpayer) it takes to pursue and actually bust a SB for prostitution is way too high for what will be a misdemeanor conviction. The law is pretty specific as to what constitutes prostitution exactly so that taking a date out to dinner and then going back to your place for sex is not considered prostitution. SBs live on that difference.

[Literal2]

Here's a question I got on another thread about the so-called amateurs on the other websites.

I'm a little confused by a few things here. First off are you really "averaging" 16 bucks a provider because the 250-300 Christmas presents seem to say otherwise. Also, I'm wondering why your bothering to share these experiences at all on this site: over the last few years there have been some people who use the site, but this site is for sharing PERTINENT information. I mean if these are girls that can only be gotten through SD then maybe you should review them there for other people who may have the opportunity to partake. And honestly the way you describe them makes them sound like prostitutes not just the way everyone else labels them.

The $16 was an average cost of finding a girl, not the cost of the girl. The girls I've seen haven't asked for anything specific. I could have walked away from them without giving them anything. On the one hand, for me, this makes it more interesting. Are they prostitutes? There's two parts to that. Morally I know some or all consider these girls "just the same as prostitutes." Morally, maybe they are. As are some wives. But legally is this prostitution? I don't see how. Maybe somebody else who understands the kind of sex LE is interested in can explain it. Personally, it seems to me these "so-called amateurs" are not like the girls on the escort sites or BP because they aren't advertising themselves as escorts, let alone prostitutes. So I would say: morally, maybe. Legally, no.

As to why post if I'm not going to give out contact info. First, I'm not a pimp or an escort referral service. Second, I've learned a lot by reading usasg over the years. There are a lot of subjects of interest on the topic of sex with women. One of them is how to find new girls to fuck who don't consider themselves pros. This is what I'm talking about. There's a million methods to find new girls to fuck. This one has a good probability of success.

[Literal2]

A couple of commercial sites specialize in hookups with girls who aren't supposed to be pros but definitely want something more than a kiss on the cheek at the end of the evening. The sites themselves offer "free trials" but once you sign up you get a couple emails per day, supposedly from girls who want to meet you. You can't actually contact them unless you become a paying member though. So are these sites worth it? Are they really a place where you can meet so-called amateurs who don't advertise elsewhere? The question is complicated by the fact that there appears to be a range of girls on the sites, from strippers to students. I have posted in other threads about my experiences with the one site I belong to. In the case of the other site, which emphasizes "arrangements," I'm not a paying member but I have a "free trial." It lists 2, 700 girls in Virginia. In Richmond, here's what one girl says about herself:

Hi my name is Angel and I am an exotic dancer. I've danced in Las Vegas and on the East Coast. Originally from Va. Beach, Virginia, my first love is the ocean, and living a healthy, happy lifestyle is so important to me. I love shopping, getting my hair done, massages, manicures, pedicures, and tanning. I am available for generous gentlemen who want to go out once or twice a week to dinner, movies, or events. I like strip clubs, visual fun for both of us. And I would like to get a new car this year.

My Appearance: 36c-24-34, long blonde hair, green eyes. 5'5, tan, athletic. 125 lbs. Look forward to meeting someone sweet and nice. Lots of love, Angel. Xxooxxx

Angel says she is 26 and doesn't indicate what kind of arrangement she is seeking, other than she wants a car. Do you think she might accept donations to a "car fund"? Probably negotiable is my take on it.

Another girl has a nude pic with her nipples whited out (?) , wants to go out and have fun, and says she is a 19 (or 20) year old receptionist seeking $3k. $5k per month (!)

"Just need help paying for tuition and some living expenses"

Then there is a 19-year old, somewhat awkward looking in her (fully clothed) pix, who says:

"Hey! I'm an artist living in richmond. I love going to the movies, hanging out with my girlfriends, meeting new people, comedy, going out, staying in, just about everything. I'm super laid back and I always have a good time. I get along with just about everybody and love to laugh and be merry. Let me know if you are interested in meeting me!

I gave this a shot earlier this year but ended up dating someone. Needless to say; I'm single again and ready to give it another go.

Nothing special about my situation. Just a young woman frustrated with "dating" men my age. I enjoy the company, conversation, and other benefits of an older gentleman."

For what it is worth, my initial estimate is that here we have 1. A moonlighting stripper; 2. An escort or a want to be escort; and 3. A girl who is clueless but willing to hang out with older men who she knows will expect sex from her.

Now to each his own, but for me, if I were going to pursue one of these girls, it would be number 3, the 19-year old "artist." It's the awkwardness and self-consciousness she displays in her post that I like, and her photo shows a reasonably pretty girl. She'd be a little nervous and we would beat around the Bush for a while, but I think she is the one with the most potential for a mind-blowing fuck. But that's just me.

So back to the question, are these sites worth it? The answer appears to me to be: not if you are looking for or prefer pros. Pros are going to advertise elsewhere. Strippers you can go fondle. Well, not in Richmond. And take for a test drive before you ask her for takeout. But an awkward, fully clothed. 19 year old artist coming off a relationship who wants to meet older men who are looking for a mistress? I don't know any other reliable way of finding such girls. Maybe if you hang out at the laundromat long enough.